Detroit Pistons 89, Orlando Magic 78
by Evan Dunlap on Jan 3, 2012 2:26 AM EST
in 2011/2012 Recaps
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PrintThe Detroit Pistons ended the Orlando Magic's four-game winning streak Monday night, 89-78, behind 26 points from Ben Gordon. The eight-year veteran shot 8-of-15 from the floor and 8-of-9 on free throws in a strong performance, his highest-scoring outing since January 2011. Dwight Howard led Orlando with 19 points, seven rebounds, and five steals. The lethargic Magic, on the second night of a back-to-back, shot just 44.4 percent, allowed 33 free-throw attempts, committed 17 turnovers, and got outrebounded by 11 in defeat.
The Magic appeared to simply un out of energy in the second half, shooting 33.3 percent after a 56.7-percent showing in the first half.
Detroit took the lead for good in the second half when Gordon drilled two free throws at the 6:16 mark. Orlando never drew closer than three points over the game's final quarter-plus.
Though the Pistons played sloppily, committing 18 turnovers of their own, they managed to maintain their energy and compete harder throughout the game. Orlando couldn't keep up, and got badly outplayed by an objectively inferior team for the second consecutive night.
| Team | Pace | Efficiency | eFG% | FT Rate | OReb% | TO Rate |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Magic | 81.4 | 95.9 | 50.8% | 22.2 | 20.0 | 20.9 |
| Pistons | 81.4 | 109.4 | 51.6% | 40.3 | 34.4 | 22.1 |
| Green denotes a stat better than the team's 2010/11 average; red denotes a stat worse than the team's 2010/11 average. | ||||||
Monday's result, coupled with the team's poor performance for much of their 102-96 victory over the Toronto Raptors on Sunday, raises questions about the Magic's standing among the league's top teams. Is their recent unimpressive play indicative of a flawed roster? Is the team merely struggling because it's playing its third back-to-back set in eight days? Orlando's just six games into a 66-game season, so it's difficult to answer with any certainty.
What's clear is that the team needs more offense from its backcourt if it's to remain competitive. Starting guards Jameer Nelson and Jason Richardson combined for eight points on 2-of-10 shooting; Rodney Stuckey and Ben Gordon, their counterparts, put up 40 on 10-of-23 from the floor.
The Magic can rebound Wednesday when they take on the Washington Wizards, the league's only remaining winless team, at Amway Center.
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Fatigue?
The season’s just started… and EVERYONE is playing back-to-back games, so please lets not start this early by making excuses!
It’s the same malaise that brought the team down last season; lack of desire/motivation, which results in poor effort and execution… all around. It starts with the team captains, Jameer & Dwight. Even though D12 got his points, you can usually gauge his effort by his rebounding effort… none.
The team should be well motivated to play 110%, to keep Howard here; show him that we can compete. But this past two games suggest that a care-less attitude is temporarily ( I hope) taken over, starting with DwIght, Nelson… even JJ Reddick’s non-nonchalant play on D and O.
I wonder if something’s going on in the locker room…
Uh...they're still human beings.
The Magic played a game Sunday night, then got on a plane and flew to Detroit either overnight or the next morning. Then they played Detroit — their 6th game in 8 days.
Detroit played a game in Detroit Sat. night, then went home and slept in their own beds. Then they had a full day of rest, without having to travel, followed by another night of sleep in their own home. Then on Monday night played the Magic.
All the teams are going to be run down this season, that’s true. But let’s not pretend that the 48 hours before tip off on Monday night were somehow equal. These are profressional athletes, they are still human and the human body does in fact have limitations.
From what I can tell, there were other problems with the game last night, and with the Magic in general…but just saying “don’t make excuses” or “everyone is playing back to backs” doesn’t just make legitimate phyiscal exhaustion just go away.
by The BBQ Chicken Madness on Jan 3, 2012 5:48 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
word
Don't be a follower homie, be a leader! And if I lose you on twitter, then so be it
by supermantotherescue on Jan 3, 2012 6:16 PM EST up reply actions
Definitely a product of fatigue/poor guard play.
We HAVE to go deeper into our bench if we plan on making it through this season alive.
Fear the Beard!
by BleedingBlueSince89 on Jan 3, 2012 4:26 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Man
J-rich needs to go.i rather stan play Liggens, Hughs, or Wafer because he just doesn’t seem to fit our system. it also wouldn’t hurt to give harper, clark and Orton some minutes so we can see what they’re capable of doing. especially Orton cause i don’t like big baby at the 5.
It was a bad move re-signing him...
It’s like Otis is just looking out for former Warrior players, nothing else. I knew we were gonna re-sign him when we should’ve let him walk, or do a sign and trade.
why Jrich?
Why can’t Reddick and Duhon start? Obviously something’s wrong with Meer and Jrich sucks.
Go Magic/Bucs/Gators/Rays!
by chiefs_55 on Jan 3, 2012 7:04 AM EST via iPhone app reply actions
Duhon start in whose spot Jrich or Jameer ? Starting him over either player makes a bad situation worse.
Me Against The World And I'm Winning
by Andeezy on Jan 3, 2012 7:42 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
You cannot be serious
Start Duhon? What universe do you live in?
by Tim333 on Jan 3, 2012 3:32 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Apparently one where Chris Duhon is good.
Maybe its a world that only exists in the year 2002 and it never changes…
I really think there's a conditioning issue.
We’ve lost our focus at times through the years but these guys look totally dead and it’s disturbing to say the least. I’d love to see the rookies get more minutes if for no other reason than energy but I understand that they may not be ready yet. The real problem is definitely in the backcourt as Evan suggested. Jameer just needs to become more of a scoring point and get comfortable in that role.
We were playing in Detroit however. That place is evil and I always cringe when I see it coming up in the schedule.
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
I think it's a coaching issue.
We have players? Why not use them? Baby at center is wrong and will not work and only put him in foul trouble. Orton should play, it’s why we drafted him. Earl is still not getting enough minutes and Wafer has more “umph” than Richardson at this point.
I don’t understand why people don’t see this. SVG is not and has not been using our players to our advantage.
I don't think any of those guys needs to see regular rotation minutes. Orton isn't ready, while Clark and Wafer are specialists.
by Evan Dunlap on Jan 3, 2012 2:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Harper?
Not for heavy double-digit minutes, but he seems capable of eating 6-8 minutes at the start/end of quarters to give the front line a bit more rest.
Though, from the summaries and dicsussion, everyone looked tired apparently. I can’t imagine a couple minutes of extra rest during the TOR game would have somehow left lots of pep in their step against a team that had a day of rest during a 3-game homestead.
by The BBQ Chicken Madness on Jan 3, 2012 4:10 PM EST up reply actions
This.
What time did the Magic get on the plane to Detroit? Sure it was a back-to-back, but back-to-backs in the condensed season are going to be rough.
I don't get the whole 'pop-tart cats pooping rainbows thing,' but then, I'm old. So, there it is.
All the more reason to Play our Players.
Fatigue won’t make us better. Playing time will. Get them on the floor, SVG.
It’s like Dantoni and his 6 man rotation.
And what’s wrong with sitting a player if he’s not “hot”???
There's some truth to what you have to say here.
But I honestly don’t see Orton, Hughes, Wafer, Clark, or Harper winning us that game last night.
But I agree in the sense that this condensed season is going to be rough, and we need to make use of the full rotation if we’re going to avoid fatigue.
I don't get the whole 'pop-tart cats pooping rainbows thing,' but then, I'm old. So, there it is.
Harper needs physical development
He’s still undersized for his height, and while the lower-contact European leagues wouldn’t show that as much, he would currently get abused at the 4. Yes, he is a good shooter and decent passer, but he’s still sub-par around the basket and is not at all a physical player. Think of him as an unpolished Rashard Lewis right now.
Comparing his stats with Ryan Anderson’s in college isn’t perfect, but they played the exact same minutes per game their last college seasons (31.8). Anderson averaged 20.4 points on 14.8 shots and 9.9 rebounds, while Harper averaged 13.0 points on 10.7 shots, and 6.9 rebounds. Harper’s got a ton of potential, but he needs a lot of work.
Bob.
Fair points.
But I have to wonder if Harper would really cost the Magic too much if he was used to take up a minute or so split between quarters, when the opposing backup PF is on the floor.
It’s a very minor and situation-based amount of time, but it would get him some time on the floor to help develop and it’d be mini-garbage time.
Again, I don’t think a few minutes here and there by Harper and Wafer would have left the Magic with enough to win last night’s game…but every little bit counts when the season is so rough. I just hope, if the young players show enough in practice to show they won’t throw away the game, SVG is willing to help everyone by giving them even a slight opportunity at getting minor minutes.
We’re only a half-dozen games into the season, and injuries are already piling up across the league. The last thing the Magic need is someone to go down with a sprain or something.
by The BBQ Chicken Madness on Jan 3, 2012 9:47 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
all the more reason to play him.
I mean, Orton is not a go-to guy at the moment, maybe not ever, let him be a foul sponge/rebounder, while DH gets a break.
Davis and the rest “should” be able to handle the scoring.
You realize the game is basketball, not pin the tail on the donkey.
You don’t play the worst guy to see if he can screw up even more, you play the best you can put on the floor. Orton is not physically ready for any minutes.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
"They say that nobody is perfect. Then they tell you practice makes perfect. I wish they'd make up their minds." -Wilt Chamberlin
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Jan 3, 2012 7:46 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Last year, It was Bass vs Anderson
This year, It’s Earl vs Anderson/Turkoglu and Davis vs Orton
"I'm a little dysfunctional
You're the problem, Please don't awakin me
And I'm that way cause back in the day
Most have forsaken me"
by 4QB on Jan 3, 2012 9:16 PM EST up reply actions
Why do we have so many specialists?
How do we even know? I haven’t seen many practices, has anybody? All 5? 8?. Orton’s not ready? And J-Rich is? This is actually our preseason, a chance to see what we have and what we need. And most of all—-trying anything. I’ll paraphrase—“Insanity, by definition, is doing the same thing again and again expecting a different result.” --A. Einstein
The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.
by mike in munich on Jan 3, 2012 8:20 PM EST up reply actions
Orton played two games in the D-League last year before injuring his knee. He played 502 minutes in college. He missed one year of high school with a knee injury.
The dude is not ready for the NBA floor.
Orton looked good in the preseason game against the Heat
so i think he’s ready for 6-10 minutes a game to see if he’s truly ready. i think it’s better then having an undersize PF playing C.
Tough to experiment when you have to win games.
The Eastern Standings are going to be a dogfight, and it’s tough to reason playing someone just to see if they’re ready to play at the NBA level. We don’t see him in practice, which is easier than a game would be. If he’s getting burned there, then SVG already knows what’s in store if he stuck him out there against an experienced NBA player.
I agree that I’d like to see Orton get some minutes in, and I felt he looked ok in the preseason — but there is a difference between preseason and regular season. If they are in a blowout…I’d be curious to see a Davis-Orton frontcourt in a “small-ball” lineup.
by The BBQ Chicken Madness on Jan 3, 2012 10:32 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I get what your saying
but with all these back to back games it’s just gonna get tougher for them to handle fatigue. Glen has only been with us for like 2 1/2 weeks and he’s playing 2 roles without that much knowledge of our system.and i doubt Anderson and J.J can keep this up without proper rest.
by Lil J on Jan 3, 2012 10:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Orton played a couple minutes and hit two long-range jumpers.
What else did he do to merit “looking good”? Mind you, this was at the end of the last pre-season game against other scrubs when Spo already decided it wasn’t worth it to try to win that game for the Heat.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Did I miss something???
Why didn’t JJ play any minutes in the 3rd quarter and then turn around and play the entire 4th? Did he get injured in the 2nd period?
No wonder JJ wasn’t on fire in the 4th, he had to sit for over a half hour. I get why he plays in the second unit (not saying I agree with it) but you can’t expect him to get in a rhythm when he sits for so long.
Give credit to Detroit’s starters who played really well. We happened to play them on a night where three of their best guys had their best night’s of the early season. It is what it is.
One Freaken Second
On a days rest.. we were not winning this game unless SVG went to our bench early and they performed
SVG is killing our players already with his short 8 man rotations.
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Jan 3, 2012 3:51 PM EST up reply actions
Dwight's our #1 asset.
Van Gundy’s our #2 asset.
Unless you’re Jackson or Pop. don’t try to second-guess Stan.
by MeToo on Jan 4, 2012 5:02 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I don't put much stock in these early-season games.
Lack of conditioning and practice time due to short training camp may explain many shortcomings. A string of back-to-backs may also expose the underlying problems.
i dont put much stock into last nights game
we had played some great basketball after the loss to OKC…this was just us being tired and checking out…it happens..and it will happen over the course of this short season..just gotta deal with it and get back on the right track
No one reads Matt666's posts.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
"They say that nobody is perfect. Then they tell you practice makes perfect. I wish they'd make up their minds." -Wilt Chamberlin
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Jan 3, 2012 7:47 PM EST up reply actions
Right ...
The time will be well spent reading Rasheed Wallace’s posts in the archives on how masterful trades of Dec 2010 will put the franchise on the right track to win the championship and retain Dwight in the process. It’s easy to post idiotic garbage – which I chose not to respond to until now – but are there any boundaries to shamelessness?
Yeah, his cheerleading for last year's trades really proved us wrong, huh.
I forgot how much I hated that.
I like to watch.
by MoveThoseChains on Jan 4, 2012 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
Detroit deserved the win
The Pistons shot 50% in the second half, compared to the 33.3% the Magic shot, and the Pistons shot a combined 17 of 25 (68%) in the second and third quarters.
The fact the Magic got outrebounded 39-28 shows that they weren’t as active as they usually are on the boards. This was only the eighth time in the Dwight Howard era where the Magic had no more than 28 rebounds in a game.
This was only the third time in Howard’s career that he played as many as 40 minutes in a game and had no more than seven rebounds.
The five steals by Howard tied his career high for steals in a game.
The staggering efficiency from Anderson and Redick in the first five games was due to come down sometime and it did against the Pistons, as they both combined for just 21 points on 20 shots.
Jason Richardson is 2 for 13 shooting in his last two games after a very good three game stretch where he shot 18 of 34.
The Magic have to bounce back against Washington Wednesday then get ready to face a tough Bulls’ team Friday.
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 Stanley Cup Champions, and future 2012 Champs
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Runners-Up
Orlando Magic... 1995 and 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Jan 3, 2012 6:15 PM EST reply actions
Jameer Nelson
needs to step his game up…and J Rich needs to start making wide open shots.. it makes me sick thinking Duhon outplayed Nelson last nite…that should NEVER happen…although i am glad duhon isnt playing like a loser anymore…maybe ill stop calling him poohon if he keeps this up
Don't be a follower homie, be a leader! And if I lose you on twitter, then so be it
by supermantotherescue on Jan 3, 2012 6:18 PM EST reply actions
What is it that Orton Isn't ready for?
To be Dwight Jr? All we need is a big body to make the opposition think twice about going to the rim. Good centers are scarce right now, SVG needs to play the kid 6 minutes a game for two reasons 1) We need an energetic DH12 on the floor, we all saw him in the 4th quarter last night. 2) Big baby has to be comfortable. If our defensive system is really that tough to learn, why are we putting in a newcomer without training camp to fill 2 roles? Remember, Davis has played with the Celtics for 4 years, and last year he went public with “I don’t know what my role is on this team.” Im not gonna be mean and say “he’s slow” but SVG needs to do all he can to NOT confuse the guy.
by Memphissleek on Jan 3, 2012 9:40 PM EST via mobile reply actions
He can get injured, he isn't exactly the strongest guy, and he doesn't know the rotations.
It has been reported that Orton is still overwhelmed when it comes to the NBA level. I’m not saying he shouldn’t play, but not in a game where we’re fighting to win. Maybe in a blow-out win we might put him in to see what he does but until then I don’t want him on the floor unless, god-forbid, a player goes down with an injury.
"If Dwight spent more time practicing and less time b!tching, then maybe he’d be playing a little better." -My Mom
by BigMac12111 on Jan 3, 2012 10:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
And put Wafer in.
We have respectable depth…use it! With this crammed schedule, Fresh legs will win this race.
by Memphissleek on Jan 3, 2012 9:43 PM EST via mobile reply actions
First game of the season I didn't watch (because my Ducks were in the Rose Bowl)
But it seems like the team is just worn out from playing 4 games in 5 days
THE OREGON DUCKS ARE ROSE BOWL CHAMPIONS!!!
A lot of space has been wasted second guessing a coach which is in the top 3 in the league.
The coaching team sees these players in practice, and is fully aware of what they are capable of. Additionally, they are in constant communication with the players in terms of their conditioning and stamina, especially in game time. The start of the season could be rough, but the coach needs to see how far his core players could be pushed, as well as the players themselves need to probe their own limitations.
by Matt1325 on Jan 3, 2012 10:49 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
Also
The players need to play themselves into game shape. I’m seeing tired players all over the league. The teams that get their normal rotations in full game shape the quickest will benefit. Another thing to note is that we are trying to put our best foot forward to convince Howard to stay. That is not accomplished by playing players who are not ready.
by Satch30 on Jan 3, 2012 11:20 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Another good reason we should play them
if Howard leaves we’ll play them eventually. why not give them a lil experience (maybe against weaker teams) to see how they handle.because it seems our bench is just J.J
If Howard leaves
they will likely get their chance. I don’t see how that relates at all to what I was saying though.
by Satch30 on Jan 4, 2012 12:10 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It's Simple
see what they can give us now. because j-rich is sucking and glen seems uncomfortable. see if we actually have a bench besides J.J.
SVG may be running his rotation precisely TO wear them out.
Conditioning.
Also, the regular rotation guys need time to gel and with short camp and the compressed schedule, games are that time.
"...sometimes your eyes lie to you..." ~SVG | I'm on Twitter
by magicfaninTN on Jan 4, 2012 2:53 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
was thinking that also...
…this team is fairly young and no chronic health issues so the sooner the team is better conditioned and physically used to this crazy schedule the better.
…also the Magic front office is probably wanting to take a long hard look at the main players (closer than normal at this early stage) to see what they have – as in a few weeks a major decision has to be made…
The Detroit curse is live and well.
I didn’t even watch this game due to the anxiety I get as a result. Can’t win them all, though. Honestly, very, very few teams have looked impressive in the early part of the season. Miami, ATL, maybe OKC and Chicago? That’s about it. Everyone’s had a clunker or two already, at the least. This season will have plenty of them, and I expect unexpected results, just like how that shaky Magic team was the 3rd seed in the ’99 season… only to lose to an upstart Philly team in the first round.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
It's not "maybe" about OKC and Chicago.
OKC continues to look like the team to beat in the West. Chicago looks better overall than they did last year (Hamilton gives some shot creation, Boozer quietly becoming consistant).
That said, I agree that nearly all teams have had a clunker. It’s one game…we’ll see how they come out tonight against Washington. If, even after a day of rest, they come out looking defeated then there’s real trouble. If they come out and play angry, then we can probably chaulk the Detroit game up to a combination of fatigue & the Detroit curse.
by The BBQ Chicken Madness on Jan 4, 2012 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
Side note about the Bulls...and how they are doing exactly what the Magic did...
The Bulls last night played 3 horrible quarters of basketball, only to come back late in the fourth to win (against ATL). Now they travel to Detroit to play the Pistons on the second game of a back-to-back after a big comback win.
Some details are different — Piston’s schedule and travel time — but the situations are pretty darn similar. It’ll be interesting to see how the Bulls do against Detroit tonight. It’d be really intresting if they came out lethargic and lost just like the Magic did.
by The BBQ Chicken Madness on Jan 4, 2012 11:05 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah... Bulls exhausted a lot of effort coming back from a 19 point deficit
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 Stanley Cup Champions, and future 2012 Champs
Chicago Bears... the end of the ten year Jerry Angelo Era after one NFC Title
Orlando Magic... 1995 and 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Jan 4, 2012 2:17 PM EST up reply actions
I don't mean to say that OKC and Chicago possibly aren't contenders.
They certainly are. I’m just saying they’ve had a couple performances that weren’t particularly elite. OKC hasn’t had a dominant performance since their home opener against us, struggled in some games before losing back-to-back games against Dallas and Portland, and Durant vs. Westbrook has already become a story (again). Chicago needed a Bynum-less LA to hand them a game, lost to the Warriors, and was down 19 at home to a (good) ATL team that was playing their 4th game in 5 nights.
I guarantee you that neither of those teams are where they want to be, but they both know they’ll get better as the season goes on. The main point I had was that there are going to be some weird results this year.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
by slickw143 on Jan 4, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
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