Chicago Bulls 102, Orlando Magic 99
by Evan Dunlap on Apr 11, 2011 2:16 AM EDT
in 2010/2011 Recaps
Email
PrintWithout Dwight Howard, the Orlando Magic pushed the Chicago Bulls, the East's top team, to the final possession in a Sunday matinee, but wound up falling by a 102-99 final after officials correctly ruled Jameer Nelson's tying three-pointer on the Magic's final play was too tardy. Orlando sorely missed Howard's defensive presence in the lane; without him there, Bulls point guard and surefire MVP candidate Derrick Rose, arguably the greatest player since Michael Jordan one of the league's three best players at his position, scored 39 points on 13-of-17 shooting, driving the lane with impunity and scoring at the rim. He finished 8-of-9 on baskets in the painted area, an unusually high number of attempts and makes for him in that zone against Orlando.
In Howard's absence, Ryan Anderson delivered an impressive performance, with 28 points and 10 rebounds (7 offensive) in just 35 minutes of hard work. His offensive rebound and kickout led to a Jason Richardson three-pointer on the Magic's penultimate possession, which brought Orlando to within a point at 100-99. Richardson caught fire in the second half of this game, pouring in 24 points on 10-of-14 shooting overall.
| Team | Pace | Efficiency | eFG% | FT Rate | OReb% | TO Rate |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Bulls | 84 | 121.5 | 65.8% | 38.3 | 22.7 | 25.0 |
| Magic | 84 | 118.2 | 50.6% | 21.0 | 33.3 | 15.5 |
| Green denotes a stat better than the team's season average; red denotes a stat worse than the team's season average. | ||||||
Orlando could have won this game, even without Howard, with a stronger showing from its starting forwards. Hedo Turkoglu and Brandon Bass combined to shoot 4-of-24 today. Turkoglu's issue was shot-selection, as he tried too many leaning, long two-point baskets off the dribble. He likes to take those, sure, but against a defense as stout as Chicago's, he can't settle. To his credit, he worked his way into 6 free-throw attempts, and dished 4 assists to 1 turnover. That's fine. But the Magic can't win many games with him firing away (13 shots in 36 minutes) and converting such a low percentage.
Bass just missed good shots. By my count he blew two dunks and rattled out several open, long twos off the catch, which he usually makes at a reasonable rate. I chalk it up to an off game for him. Shots didn't drop today. He played well in other areas, particularly on defense. Carlos Boozer, whom he checked for much of the afternoon, shot 3-of-7 from the floor.
The Bulls took control of the game early in the second quarter, opening up an 11-point lead as Orlando rolled with its second unit, weakened by Anderson's shift to the starting lineup, J.J. Redick's prolonged absence due to injury, and Quentin Richardson's suspension. With Rose resting, the Bulls' underrated second unit extended the lead. When Anderson, Nelson, and Jason Richardson returned, Orlando restored order, and tied the game at 46 at the first-half buzzer when Nelson swished a heave from midcourt.
But that first few minutes of the second quarter, it seemed to me, decided the game. Chicago has reserves who can contribute on both ends; the Magic do not, or at least not in this game. The rest of the way, I thought Orlando played the visitors fairly evenly. Neither team led by more than five points after intermission.
The loss means virtually nothing to Orlando, except that it will have to win its final two games to avoid finishing with its worst record of the Stan Van Gundy area. Chicago, which has already clinched homecourt advantage throughout the Eastern Conference Finals, needed the win to keep pace with the San Antonio Spurs for the league's best overall record. The Magic and Bulls are on the same side of the playoff bracket, and will meet in the second round if the Magic can get past the Atlanta Hawks in the Quarterfinals.
A final note on Rose: he's a brilliant player, OK, and when I refer to him as "arguably the greatest player since Michael Jordan one of the league's three best players at his position," I'm needling his army of hyper-defensive fans, not disrespecting him, unless you think saying "this player isn't the best" means "this player is not any good," in which case you are beyond hope.
0 comments
|
2 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
yup, I thought so too.
Fun game to go to, I cant wait for the playoffs.
"I never look at the points," Howard said. "Rebounds and blocks are what win games for me."
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
yea but...you gotta admit
Derrick Rose is pretty freakin AWESOME ;)
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Apr 11, 2011 2:52 AM EDT reply actions 7 recs
If Rose is merely good...
Dwight Howard really sucks! :P
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 5 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
by BAB-Bass on Apr 11, 2011 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Derrick Rose cured my halitosis !
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Derrick Rose's urine cures cancer
"Evan!
Unban me from the OPP!"...........David Polega
by AB's triple double on Apr 11, 2011 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Derrick Rose?
TheGiantSquid: Derrick Rose…How do I begin to explain Derrick Rose?
Hubie Brown: Derrick Rose is flawless.
Kenny Smith: I hear his hair’s insured for $10,000.
Dwayne Wade: I hear he does car commercials…in Japan.
Basketbawful: His favorite movie is Space Jam.
Kelly Dwyer: One time he met Charles Barkley on a plane…
Bill Simmons: …and he told him he was pretty.
Dwight Howard: One time he punched me in the face…it was awesome.
I'm a girl.
by TheGiantSquid on Apr 11, 2011 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I also heard that Derrick Rose can turn water into wine!
Dwight's watching you! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Dwight Howard: Strong as an ox, swift as a gazelle.
Some SB12 with chlorhexidine and Zn should take care of your Halitosis for you
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 5 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
by BAB-Bass on Apr 11, 2011 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
No need. Derrick Rose looked at me through the TV screen and cured it.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions
And that's why he's the MVP...
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 5 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
by BAB-Bass on Apr 11, 2011 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I was really happy with the Magic effort
This game should give the Magic a confidence boost should the two teams meet in the second round. It took an insanely efficient game from Derrick Rose (39 points on 17 shots) to save the Bulls from a loss.
The 28 points from Ryan Anderson was his career high, beating his previous high game by five points.
The Bulls became just the second opponent in Magic franchise history to shoot at least 60% from the field, at least 53% on three pointers, and at least 88% on free throws; and it was only the third time since 2000 that a team has been able to shoot so successfully from all three areas.
And yet the Magic nearly pulled off the upset!
I was sitting directly behind the basket, and had an excellent view of Jameer’s last second shot. Even though we were all celebrating, I knew they weren’t gonna count that basket because I could see the light go on the backboard just before he released it.
The streak of Magic wins with me in attendance is now over at 13 games; this is the first time since December of 2004 I’ve seen the Magic lose in person.
Great game to watch, though. Rose was awesome, but the Magic were almost as awesome despite missing their MVP candidate and two key reserves.
Hopefully, these two teams face each other in the second round, and should make for a great playoff series.
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Apr 11, 2011 3:13 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Rec
Pretty crazy that the Bulls shot so well from everywhere on the court and still almost got beat. Maybe Stan finally knocked some urgency into the players on the team not named Dwight.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
by slickw143 on Apr 11, 2011 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I wish I had your confidence.
I just haven’t seen the consistent “intensity” from players other than Dwight and Jameer to indicate that they’ve really taken that loss to the Celtics last year to heart.
I’m hoping beyond hope that it changes though.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Its not like I think they are the best team in the world
The NBA playoffs are all about matchups. The Magic are a terrible matchup for the Bulls. I love stats, but you have to look at the mental aspect of the game as well. If you are Orlando wouldn’t you want to play Atlanta, play Chicago’s One Man Band, then whats left of the Celtics or Heat? I am not saying they tanked, but that is probably why the effort has been the same. The 9 game winning streak was no fluke. Its not like this team has been blown out. Only two double digit losses were to Celtics and Lakers. Magic have a nice 7 man rotation and an enigma in Gilbert Arenas. They have two good individual defenders in Q and Superboy. And they have SVG. When you step back, take emotion out of it, this team is pretty talented. They just need to be engaged. Players being engaged is like the wind, you can’t see it, but you can feel it when it is there.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I agree 100% with what you said, I really do.
I guess I just have a little less faith in feeling that breeze. Again, I want to be wrong more than anything, but we’ll have to see. Thankfully, the painful wait for the playoffs to start is almost over.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Hah that last sentence of yours needs some work...
I only say that because I had to re-read it like 3 times to get the meaning.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
He sprints up and down the court all the time.
Good job not knowing what you’re talking about. He routinely beats opposing big men down the court. And he is a willing passer as well when the double-team comes. Try again.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
That magic team
Played like the suns with D they matched up well against us. But the Bulls front court played like absolute crap and while the Bulls shot over 60% they gave up over 20 turnovers which kept orlando in the game. Dwight will slow down their ball movment back to the “Dwight gets the ball in the post and pass it to the outside for a contested three” plan
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
And no this is not a diss to orlando
that small lineup gives us problems i.e against the suns.
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Yup exactly
Look people here like Rose. Just because they have him fifth on their MVP ballot does not mean they hate. Dwight is doing something thats happened like twice in the last 35 years. Also is the best defensive player of the last 20 years. But we will find out in the playoffs. You are going to defend your guy we are going to defend our guy. Not our fault that Ric Bucher can’t take Derrick Rose’s……..out of his mouth and disgusts us. When Charles Barkley says that the probable runner up and in many people’s eyes MVP is the most underrated player in the NBA you can see what Magic fans get angry.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Keep comforting yourself with that talk.
You do know that the Bulls were only the 2nd team all year to shoot 60% against the Magic, and that Rose was 8-9 inside the paint against the team that is the best at protecting the rim? I guess Howard doesn’t matter in that regard.
There’s only been one game this season where the “match-up” will have any weight, and that was the game played in March in Orlando where the Bulls won. The time we blew you guys out doesn’t matter because we had a different team. The time you guys beat us down in Chicago doesn’t matter because Jameer was out basically the whole game. And this game sure as hell doesn’t matter. So going off the 1 legit game to base match-ups off for the season, if you want to expect that the Magic are going to get out-rebounded by 20 each game in a potential series… then okay.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
by slickw143 on Apr 11, 2011 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
im not "conforting myself" nor that i need to
Noah played like dog crap (and has been inconsistent for a while now) Boozer was well Boozer and didnt rebound well or box out at all. Nobody boxing out Thibs not playing Kurt or Asik more for some unkown reason Taj was the only big that played well, that game 21 turnovers more than our average (due to pretty good defense by orlando). Like I said its like playing the Suns with defense bulls struggle with that but its not like they played the Bulls at their best either.
So again im not “conforting myself” nor that i need to, thats what happened Magic front court played with much more hustle getting boards while Noah and Booz for whatever reason sleepwalking and not doing anything playing lazy and not boxing out. The Bulls front court will not sleep walk again Thibs will make sure of that even though they won that game Rose wasn’t happy Thibs wasn’t and Noah and Booz shouldn’t be happy because they got embarrassed that game.
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Also to one rational fan to another
Good luck bro
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Good luck to you guys too.
I really have nothing against this Bulls team at all. They’re a great team with a great coach, and they were built the “right” way (with a little bit of lottery luck).
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
I like the Magic and Dwight
Just hate them taking 30 threes a game cause it reminds me of a douche that i played in NBA Live 10 lol
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
We had a ton of lottery luck too, in the years we actually had picks...
haha
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
Dwight runs up and down the court in every possession...
the hell?
I'm a girl.
by TheGiantSquid on Apr 11, 2011 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Apparently, Dwight lacks mobility.
Or… stamina? Or…
Aw, hell. I’m done trying to make sense of that comment.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Their getting this BS from the ESPN Chicago writer
there’s already a fanshot of it http://www.orlandopinstripedpost.com/2011/4/11/2104009/howard-cant-match-roses-leadership#comments
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Apr 11, 2011 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Aww, sorry your streak is snapped. It was a good game even though a loss
Because Bill Simmons wife leaves something on the table every night.
It was an excellent game to watch
The Magic still have a 13 game winning streak with me in attendance when Dwight Howard has played :-)
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Apr 11, 2011 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
rose is very good.
and fun to watch…but not the best… far from it, chicago is loaded with talent (mostly defensive talent) and curiously even chicago fans behave like their team would be like cleveland without rose.. take rose out and insert lebron, wade, kobe or cp-3 chicago would be better… the critical part of the team is the coach (and the defense that he brings) and rose, not rose alone…
Derrick Rose may not be the only reason why the Bulls are where they are...
…but he has done more than his share offensively and leadership-wise in leading the Bulls to a 60 win season and the number one seed in the East.
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Apr 11, 2011 4:14 AM EDT up reply actions
Very happy with the fight from Orlando
Hopefully J-Rich and Anderson can find that sort of shooting rhythm more often, even with Dwight back in the lineup. But the Magic will need a lot more from Bass and Turk than 4-24 shooting if they want to go anywhere in the playoffs.
Back on topic...
Was that one of those so-called moral victories last night? Cause I loved seeing Jameer hit that “buzzer-beater” last night…even if it didn’t count.
I’m not big on moral victories, but the way we played that game last night softened the blow of the “L” yesterday.
YEP.
Without Howard, the team actually played some defense. We were in it the whole time. Still I wanted more drives to the basket instead of high picks for a 3pt shot.
Seriously.
I get that you are a Magic fan. I really do. But stop complaing about 3’s. They will not stop. As long as SVG is here, they will be here. As long as they are the BEST shot in the NBA to take, they will be here. You do realize that the 3’s kept us in the game right? I mean you do realize that. And that we almost went to overtime via……wait for it……..a 3!!!!! Shots at the rim with Dwight and 3’s are what we do. Just accept it and move on.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Terms like "efficiency" just are not in his lexicon.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
REMEMBER IF WE DRIVE, WE WIN
Aye, business is business and money is money i never said we were friends.
by 4QB on Apr 11, 2011 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
seems we're invested with bullsfans annoyus
a common but pesky rodent that likes to roam the blogger world looking for any perceived slight against their overhyped player.
I recommend a solid blow to the head from one of Dwight Howard’s elbows. That should do the trick.
Free at last!
JJ sucks.
Its worked twice before!
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Apr 11, 2011 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Pretty good game for something that was ultimately meaningless.
I guaran-damn-tee the Bulls will not have any offensive performances like that if we meet in the second round. Assuming, of course, that Dwight doesn’t collect the 8 techs or (whatever it is) to garner an automatic suspension for the playoffs in the first round against ATL.
We can replicate this offensive success, though. The wing players need to not allow themselves to get stagnant when Dwight has the ball in the post. He has shown he’s willing to pass (unlike Bass) when receiving the double-team. He just has to have a decent prospect to pass the ball to, and that guy who receives the first pass needs to swing it over to someone else if they have an even better look. Or we can have some more cutting by J-Rich, Arenas, Q, and JJ. Just… don’t stand around and watch Dwight.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
JJ's a willing cutter
His off the ball movement is one of the things Orlando have really been missing recently.
The others…not so much.
by eltharion_doa on Apr 11, 2011 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions
What is JJ gonna do at the rim?
The problem I see is we dont have a MattBarnes that is cutting to the basket for a dunk or layup. Our team just isnt made up of guys who can finish strong at the rim.
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Apr 11, 2011 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions
There's more to cutting than just finishing at the rim
Orlando uses cutters to move the defense around, not to get into the paint. That’s what Howard’s for.
Bass, Anderson and J-Rich can all throw down in the paint. I’d like to see those guys cut more, but I’m not convinced that’s Howard’s best pass, and the last thing he needs is more turnovers.
by eltharion_doa on Apr 12, 2011 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Magic fans just ask yourselves this
A top ten offense performing like a top offense or a mediocre offense performing ungodly for a seven game series? If they lose, then I was wrong and I will eat crow. But the only team that spooks me is the Heat because of the possibility of LeBron and Wade shooting 25-30 free throws a game in a series. Scares me. Bulls? Elite defense, but terrible offense. Boston? Team has mentally lost their identity and no longer are the defense they once were. Again don’t confuse inconsistent with lack of talent.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
The only team that scares me is the Hawks.
Hopefully the next team that scares me is Indiana or Chicago.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 10:47 AM EDT reply actions
I understand why everyone is looking forward to the 2nd round series (it's the LEAST the Magic could do)
but really, they haven’t played the Hawks all that well this year. I’m with you.
Still, great effort yesterday against a top team like the Bulls without Dwight. If only they (the supporting cast) could play with that determination and urgency more consistently.
Magic Fan since the 1992-1993 Season.
Caracas, Venezuela.
by North of the South on Apr 11, 2011 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah the Hawks are finally playing everybody in their right positions
They are pretty much better at the 2,3 and 4 than the Magic. Hinrich and Collins are at least competent defenders. Its not gonna be easy like last year
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Apr 11, 2011 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions
It will trust me.
maybe 5 games. They have no coach. And going into their building and winning is not exactly daunting. They have legit second banana’s, third banana’s and a fourth banana. But they have no numero uno I am the man follow my lead guy. Since we are talking Rose, he would be great there. But seriously if they had an elite PG, that could be a case where the team is ok with their best player being a PG. Chris Paul on that team would be a miracle. But they will not do anything in the playoffs.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
...a very good sense of keeping things in perspective
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Apr 11, 2011 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions
I love the headers Evan is putting up lately, by the way.
I wanna be like “Oh, you got jokes now huh?”
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
bulls fan...sorry
was wondering a few things…
is your resentment towards rose more because of the constant media hype towards him and thus the lack of hype dwight howard gets (and this being a possibly more economical reason, orlando small market, bulls big market….stern wants big markets to flourish)
While i understand that you guys thiink that dwight howard is the true mvp, i wonder if that means that derrick rose to you guys is not just the WRONG person to win the mvp, but perhaps unworthy of being in the conversation.
I also question that if circumstances were changed, how would you guys react. For example say you had rose, and for whatever reason you were the top seed in the east, and we had howard and were number 4. Say then because of chicago being the bigger market (and stern calls it in) howard is the frontrunner for mvp. Would your reaction to the situation be the same. Meaning would you then curse out the nba media mongals for choosing the bigger market name as opposed to your guy, or would you nod in accordance and say, well he does deserve it because of his stats, despite our team having the better record.
For those who would suggest that rose is just completely unworthy of being mvp, I will assume that you guys are driven on “he doesnt have the stats to prove it” concept. In which case what would it take for you guys to perhaps change your opinion on that. Would rose have to have the stats during the playoffs to earn your acceptance that yes, perhaps he isnt a bad mvp choice. What if after the series was over (say you end up winning in 7) rose has those numbers.
I know you believe (rightfully i would say) that without howard the game rose had yesterday wouldnt have happened. But say when howard is in the game rose still goes off on your team, still finds holes to penetrate through, finds ways to get his jumper off. What if in a 7 game series the bulls (im only speaking hypothetically) sweep the magic, and derrick rose is constantly the high scorer and lead assist leader. Would then it be okay to consider rose a rightful mvp?
I can understand you guys being upset with defensive bulls fans (like me) who come to this site and throw up arguments that you find trivial, and the media that continues to talk derrick rose while mentioning howard in an afterthought. I can understand you guys unwilling to accept rose being more important than dwight howard, but after reading some comments, i think that it might be more you guys dont think hes worthy of being in the conversation. LIke john hollinger, you guys (or some of you at least) may consider he is truly the 6th rank on an mvp ballot.
I apologize for the vagueness of the mvp debate, i apologize for us bulls fans being so defensive and at times disrespectful. In honesty, despite our coach and our pieces, we cant see us being the number 1 defensive team without derrick rose, because in order to maintain that defensive discipline, winning and purpose is in order (espcially to transform so quickly), and i cant see us being the 4th seed much less the 1seed without rose and the impact and attention he demands on the offensive end.
But i am biased, as i am sure you guys are as well. So i dont mean to pusuade you with my words, i dont want to say that i am right because i dont know to be honest. Mvps are more often or not considered to be faux in hindsight as opposed to present tense. But i was just wondering if most of you would ever consider being persuaded, if there was something that could persuade you into buying into the idea that “maybe rose did deserve it afterall”.
I like this site by the way, i like evan and his jokes, i like the intellegence of this blog, its pretty cool. I think you guys are pretty awesome that you dont vehemently kick us guys out from other blogs just for not sharing the same opinion as your fanbase. Thats much apperciated
Sorry for the rant….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
Most people who disagree with the whole thing like Rose...
Hell, there are plenty of people who think Rose is certainly worthy of contention. Rose is certainly one of my favorite players in the league right now, and anyone who is saying Rose isn’t a great player already at 22 is just blind. However, there are two problems that are annoying.
1.) The fact that it’s been deemed that he’s a runaway winner, when it clearly should not be the case. This should be a close vote between a few guys who have had great seasons. There is no clear-cut winner this year, but the fact that the media is playing it up like Rose is head-and-shoulders above everyone else is annoying.
2.) The fact that the usual rhetoric of “defense wins championships” or whatever seems to completely go out the window when talking about Dwight. All anyone ever wants is for him to score 30 points a game, even though he’s been the most dominant interior defender since, I dunno, Hakeem? Maybe even going back before that? He is by far the most important defensive player in the league, but people seem to think he should just be content with getting Defensive Player of the Year, as if that’s not valuable.
A poster on here named EnnBee said it best, so I’ll quote him again here:
" ‘I said in the offseason that Dwight needed to do about 28 ppg 14 rbs 4 blks 2 stls 2 asst.’
Oh, is that all? You realize that no one in the history of the NBA has EVER done that right? In fact, no one has ever averaged 28/14/4 – forget adding in assists and steals. In fact, using Dwight’s stats this year of 23.1/14.1/2.4 there have been only 2 players to have ever done that – Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Bob McAdoo 35 years ago. In the past 3 decades NO ONE has.
This is part of the ridiculous bar that seems to always be raised in front of Dwight. Apparently, for him to get the recognition of having a great season, he must have the greatest season in the history of the NBA or he’s somehow dogging it.
Absolute insanity."
What else do people want from Dwight?
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
hah looking at it that way
yea i could totally get the angst from the award. I earlier on blogabull wrote that the league should really either define the mvp award and set requirements or criteria for it, or they should really just get rid of the award. Or else have the award done by coaches and players not the media members. I think the mvp is becoming like the all-star starters voting…a watered down media spectacle that has no real weight to a players status.
For me i wouldnt have minded if howard had won the mvp, the only reason i really started getting defensive for rose winning it is when guys like tom ziller, john hollinger, and some miami writers came out with anti rose articles instead of ’heres who i think should be the mvp", maybe we bulls fans are defensive in that way.
Instead of mvp they should just have like story of the year award, or something
Defensive Player of teh year
Offensive Player of the year (get rid of scoring champ)
Story of the year
Rookie of the Year
6th Man of the year
Coach of the Year
Most Improved Player
something like that wouldnt be a bad list of awards, and just retain the finals mvp (since its far more definitive, the most important player in the entire playoffs is usually (save for jerry west) belongs to the team that wins the championship so theres some set criteria
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
The way I see it is this.
Derrick Rose is the Most Improved Player and is in contention for the MVP. Dwight Howard is the Defensive Player of the Year and is in contention for the MVP. I have absolutely no problem whatsoever with Rose winning MVP because he’s a great player and as everybody points out it is a great story.
The problem is that it’s not a case of “Who will win the MVP in an even playing field?” It’s a case of “Who can contend with Rose’s runaway MVP season?” I don’t really like to be snarky, but I think that’s why some people are being snarky about it. They feel that they have to be louder and more extreme to contend with the Rose “consensus MVP” line of thinking.
Plus, as was said before the standard that people hold Dwight to is just crazy. Case in point, last year I was watching NBA TV last year during their playoff preview. I think it was Chris Webber arguing that Dwight still needed to get a lot better to be thought of as a top 5 player. Then it was brought up to him that Dwight had a season statistically that nobody has had since Wilt Chamberlain. His eyes popped out of his head and he said “Wow, I didn’t realize that.” That’s what bugs us. His contribution just isn’t flashy enough to gather anyone’s attention, but he’s making a huge difference on the court.
So I have absolutely zero problem with Derrick Rose or his MVP candidacy. It’s just the media and casual NBA observer’s very wrong opinion of Dwight Howard that I have a problem with. Hopefully this debate has helped bring that out a little bit.
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
by cgsimone on Apr 11, 2011 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
yea that makes sense
damn media!!!! I am sure if it was the other way around we bulls fans would react the same way. Its all going according to sterns plan….that evil bastid
And i love rose, but yea if i were a gm and i had to build around one guy, id choose howard. There isnt another center like him. It sucks but its like the slam dunk competetion all over again, just because hes bigger and stronger, people often dont understand that what hes doing is so damn amazing….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
Recommended
Excellent post.
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Apr 11, 2011 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I got a Rec from the Magic fan from Chicago!
I’ll take that!
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYy
Why do i always get this response!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
thats okay…i expected it…ur loss ;)
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
"ur loss" except not really
Google tl;dr if you “always get this response”. You might learn something! :O
I'm a girl.
by TheGiantSquid on Apr 11, 2011 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
too long, didnt read
im sorry…why are u so angry, my comment (as indicated by the wink wink face) had like, no angst in it whatsover….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
You rep us well Piccolo
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
There should be an angst font.
So that people know when you are interjecting angst into a comment.
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
Derrick Rose just caught a baby falling from the Sears tower, with two fingers!!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions
This is just my response so I am not sure how OPP will feel.
I like Rose. Love that he is humble. Love that he buys into what his coach says. Love that he works hard. I love that he plays better in the clutch then he does during the game. However, I don’t even think he is the most Most Valuable point guard. I mean do you see what Chris Paul has to work with and what he is doing on one knee? What pisses fans in general off the most is that a person like Ric Bucher states that Derrick Rose works so hard and such a great leader and etc., etc.,. That is unfair to every other candidate. I mean it is not like LeBron and Dwight were built like Marvel Comic super hero look a likes. They had to work to get that big. I love Dwight, but did you his post moves before the last two years? Today he is practically unstoppable on the low block. What makes Magic fans upset is that Dwight is getting compared to Centers of yesteryear, while Rose is compared to a one-legged Chris Paul, an old Steve Nash, and Deron Williams who is on the New Jersey Nets. Did you realize that Dwight is having a season that only Bob McAdoo and Kareem Abdul Jabbar have had? Those guys played a long time ago. That means he is having a season that the following have never had: Shaq, Duncan, Hakeem, Robinson, KG, Ewing, Barkley, Karl Malone and Moses Malone have never had. Let that sink in for 10 seconds.
Now Magic fans also hate how Bulls fan defend their guy by saying stats don’t matter but always bring up his numbers in the clutch, his team record, and the fact that he is in the top 10 for scoring and assists. Those are all stats. So when Dwight is in the top for FOUR categories does that mean less? See what I am getting at? Rose is very, very, VERY fun to watch. The body control is unprecedented. But that shot only counts for 2 points. What’s the difference between some amazing crossover with a 1080 spin and a hook shot if they both count for 2 points? Everyone says Dwight does not dominate like Shaq did. I don’t ever remember Shaq having to do everything defensively for his team. And as great as Shaq was, is it a little embarrassing that he only has 4 titles with Penny, Kobe, Dwyane, and Steve/Amar’e? Duncan got 4 and only two were with Robinson. Imagine if Duncan had Penny, Kobe, Wade, and Steve Nash.
So just because Dwight Howard does not average 25 ppg he is somehow no longer an MVP? Bill Simmons asks why does Dwight still defer to Jameer Nelson? Why did nobody ask why Shaq deferred to Wade or Kobe? Jameer has closed out games fine for us. Asks the Knicks. Ask the Celtics. Ask the Heat. Dwight defers, because he understands it takes sacrifice and a team to win a title. He figured this out pretty quickly. But he gets hammered for it. This why Orlando fans get upset. Because Dwight has to be the best player ever for him to get some love.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Dwight's a decent player
He’s just not the MVP…
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 5 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
This statement just proves my claim that
“Ya’ll are just clueless”
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 5 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
by BAB-Bass on Apr 11, 2011 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Derrick Rose invented basjetball, not some damn Yankee!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Really?
Does Derrick Rose get himself or his team high-percentage baskets? Because a lot of point guards do. It’s not about counting stats, it’s about making the offense work.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Rose absolutely gets his team HP baskets.
Not only that. When he draws 2-3 defenders and is fouled but doesn’t get the call (which happens a ton) causing him to miss the shot, he creates easy put-backs for Noah, Boozer, Gibson, Brewer, Deng and others that don’t show up in his stats but that still helps the team immensely.
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 4 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
...or that you are.
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
Chris Paul surely proved that last night.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
Ohhhhhhh
I get it, the most efficient point guard =s the best. Okay, thanks for letting me know.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
Didn't say that.
By that logic Kevin Martin is the best player ever. No you see when Rose and Paul have the same intangibles and Paul kills him every single stat except points that is what makes Paul the best Point guard in the NBA.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
So Paul is the
better point guard and Rose is the better player? I can dig it. If Paul were a better player tho, his team would probably have more wins.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
Derrick Rose just freed Libya!!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions
He could, you know...
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 5 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
I asked Derrick Rose to take my SAT's!!!
oops…
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions
And the University standout Howard scored what?
Oh, he didn’t even attend Uni? My bad…
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 4 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
Neither did Rose
If you cheat on the tests and your grades to get in, you cannot actually pretend you went to college.
At least Dwight didn’t take away some other players chance to go to Memphis or the rest of his team’s accomplishments for the year.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
Howard graduated with a 3.0 GPA and scored in the 900's on the SAT in his junior year.
He would have been admitted at most bif colleges.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 12, 2011 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Please don't act like 1 and done guys actually go to college
They take the minimum # of credit hrs 2 be eligible to play. (12 in case anyone was curious) and they take things like beginning golf, tennis, health and wellness, etc. Then the 2nd semester, they enroll in w/e classes they want and don’t attend. They all do it.
And don’t get testy about proven facts. They are what they are. Dwight wasn’t inhibited by the rules of that time to be 1 yr removed from HS graduation, unlike Rose. He would’ve been straight out of HS too.
"I never look at the points," Howard said. "Rebounds and blocks are what win games for me."
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
But one-and-done- guys in most states take their own SAT's.
Rose had someone else take his, otherwise he could not be admitted. Some schools frown on this, in fact Memphis forfeited its 38 win season.
Dwight, with a 3.0 GPA and SAT around 950 would be admitted to most schools and would be an excellent basket weaver by now. But he would have done it honestly.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 13, 2011 7:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Dwight wins the citizenship award
We can all see the Dwight is a fantastic human being and the reason he is so awesome is cause he loves Jesus.
by houstonbull on Apr 13, 2011 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Dwight would have gone to Duke.
At worst Georgia Tech with Josh Smith.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I don't think Duke would let him in unless he improved his SAT's.
Georgia Tech would have snatched him up.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 13, 2011 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Because GT is such a less prestigous(spelling) school
But I think we both agree Dwight could have gone anywhere.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Carolina would have taken him.
"I never look at the points," Howard said. "Rebounds and blocks are what win games for me."
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
Never said Rose was a better player either.
Paul is a better player, better point and a better building block. He is 3rd on my MVP list in front of Kobe and then Rose.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Yes.
That’s obvious. Efficiency * production = quality. Even a crappy player could score 30 points a game if you gave him 35 possessions to do it. You just wouldn’t give him those possessions, because he’d misuse them.
Rose isn’t crappy, but he’s not any more efficient than the league average. You’re feeding the ball into him, and he’s getting 1.08 points per shot/pair of FTs. That’s what a league-average offense gets. He wouldn’t be giving you any competitive advantage if your defense wasn’t able to hold opposing teams to fewer points per shot.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Deron Williams has been playing injured this year
and has not played better than Rose by any measure of which I am aware.
Paul should have been the MVP that year Kobe won it
But after his injuries hes not the same and not really that dominant
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
No no no
Lebron should have, look at his stats!!!
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
by chicity773 on Apr 11, 2011 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
YES!!
STATS ARE EVERYTHING!
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
by T.Moore on Apr 11, 2011 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
So if stats are nothing why did Jordan MVP?
Sure seems like he had the best stats….
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Remember how good his teams were?
Or have you forgotten? Outside of his 1988 historic team, the Bulls were always one of and if not the best record wise, in the NBA.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
*historic season
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
You mean 98 team as far as historic right?
Yes but he won MVPs in the 80’s as well.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Jordan should've won the MVP every year he played for about an 8 year stretch.
For about a seven year stretch, the award should’ve gone to either Shaq or Duncan. The fact that it didn’t shows it tends to lack meaning.
You ony say it lacks meaning 'Cause Dwight's not gonna get it... :P
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 5 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
Can you stop with the moronic emotes?
They only further strengthen your standing as a worthless troll who has yet to bring any substance to this debate at all. You’re not making Bulls fans look any better either.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Dude im a bulls fan
and i think thats weak
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Derrick Rose makes MJ look like Chris Duhon!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Dude
you are making yourself look like a tool
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
I think it's hilarious
I'm a girl.
by TheGiantSquid on Apr 11, 2011 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I do too
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Apr 11, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
No. Look at the edit.
And he won 1 MVP in the 80s (1988 Bulls only won 50 games). Won 5 in the 1990s. 90-91, 91-92, 95-96 & 97-98.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
As he should have
He was the most dominating player. Rose dominates 3 minutes while Dwight dominates both ends for 48 minutes. Thank you
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
You're not welcome.
Because, I wasn’t arguing for Rose and against Howard. You guys are stuck on that. It’s pretty funny actually.
Maybe Howard will get Finals MVP.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
Also,
“stats” showed that your very own former Magic player, T-Mac should have won at least 1 MVP. You want to argue his case?
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
Seriously, people need to understand that.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Derrick Rose personally bought every MVP voter a mule and 10 acres!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I am rec'ing these for persistence.
You are a true competitor, with a lot of heart. You might not be putting up the best arguments, but you never quit. And it is really this, your story, that makes you the MVP of this thread.
If Redfield is OPP's best poster, and he's holding something back every night how can you say that doesn't affect OPP? He's their best guy! Your best guy leads! Your best guy sets the tone for everyone else! When Redfield cruises through game threads, makes dumb jokes, earns even dumber recs and disappears during debates (he doesn't even rank in the top 125 for insightful responses to trolls this season), you don't think that has anything to do with OPP's uneven season?
by Redfield on Apr 11, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
But stats show that I had a higher true posting percentage.
Not to mention more condescending remarks per 36 minutes. And I was second only to Mateo9399 in defensive posts.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
I yield to slickw143. In fact Derrick Rose says you are the BEST!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Voters already pegged you to win.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Better shooter from FG, FT, 3, more assists and more steals than Derrick Rose.
Yup totally his fault he plays the way a point guard should and tries to get his crappy teammates envolved. What wait…..
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
So you are saying that Rose
shouldn’t do whatever it takes for his team to win? He doesn’t care about stats only about winning
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
by T.Moore on Apr 11, 2011 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
So that makes him MVP?
I guess LeBron, Dirk, Dwight, Kobe, Wade, Aldridge, Paul only play basketball for the hell of it. Ric Bucher when did you take over T. Moore’s profile from blogabull?
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Ok then this should be better
Rose is the best scoring option on his team he HAS to play the way he does if he doesn’t the bulls would most likely not be this good, He IS the offense teams try to stop him and, Rose unlike Lebrick or Dwight is consistently CLUTCH on the offensive end everyone knows who’s getting the ball in those minutes and they can’t do anything about it he would either take it himself or pass to an open teamate. He plays his best against the great teams. and this
With his 2,000 points, 300 rebounds, 600 assists, Derrick Rose joins only Oscar Robertson, Michael Jordan, LeBron James and John Havlicek, and with one more block becomes the only point guard ever with those stats and ranking with Robertson as the most productive seasons ever for a point guard.
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Also I understand that you dont hate Rose but just the hype (although that sounds like what skip bayless would say)
But he’s not just “decent”
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Someone said Dwight was decent
What exactly did you think I was going to say?
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
That was probably sarcasm from him
so forget what i said here
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Its already been forgotten man.
You seem like a rational Bulls fan. I really hate that Bill Simmons and Ric Bucher have made us hate each other. It is really their fault.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
You seem cool too
and yes screw ESPN
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Not all ESPN.
Their truehoop network is fantastic. ESPN TV is what drives us mad sometimes.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I hate guys like
dilfer, tim hasselbeck, and cowherd
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Wilbon is ok, say stupid crap
until get gets homer mode. and Bayless just say dumb crap just to say it
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
PTI Wilbon is OK. NBA Wilbon is rather annoying
Arenas needs to hurry up and shoot himself (out of this slump).
^This
I like Cowherd. Sometimes he is too casual for my tastes but I like his perspective. I am starting to like Goutlib a lot lately. But then again he is a little arrogant sometimes. Legler seems to be the most legit and Rose up until his little DUI epidsode.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Cowherd
is an idiot.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
Derrick Rose is going to get Colin Cowherd fired tomorrow!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
NBA wilbon i dont care for
PTI wilbon is cool
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
You like Wilbon because he's a chicago person.
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
Truehoop sucks.
It’s pretty funny how we like those that say things we won’t to hear. Several of the true hoop guys are considered Rose “haters” so I don’t like them.
Seems they have a more favorable opinion of Dwight, so Magic fan base likes them.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
*want
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
Because they always talk without emotion
And they all have Rose in their top 3 as well. Yup Rose haters/
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Ding, ding ding!
You caught that.
Clinched 1st seed in the East. MN(SAS): 5 MN(Bos): 0 MN(LAL): 0 MN(Mia): 0 MN(Orl): 0
Stats are important
But i hate it when so use it as their ONLY argument Like Hollinger does ALL THE TIME…but still that is impressive…
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
He doesn't
He watches more games than you and me combined. He has Derrick Rose 4th. Re read his article. Iverson and Nash all had BETTER season than the years they won MVP. Why weren’t they rewarded then? That is his point. I don’t agree with him that if they had Westbrook they would be the same. Westbrook is great because of Durant. That is what makes him an MVP candidate. Now if you put Paul on the Bulls they are probably the same or better or 2 games worst. If you put Andrew Bogut on the Magic, we become a slightly better version of the Golden State Warriors.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Yes.
Isn’t it annoying when people base their arguments only on what happens in the games? There are all kinds of stuff that don’t show up in the stats, like…
…no, wait. Stats are the record of what happens in the games. Never mind.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Intensity and aggressive behavior.
They don’t show up in stats!
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Well, of ccourse they do.
if Rose was a little less “intense” and “aggressive”, he’d probably take fewer shots and make a higher percentage of them.
But that would help his team rather than his numbers, so what are the odds, really?
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
by 3.3seconds on Apr 11, 2011 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Well played.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Honestly, seriously
Rose is the best PG in the league and a top 3 player in the league. The kid just dropped almost 40 on you guys last night. All this talk about who’s more dominant or who’s supporting cast got what, or who’s got a great defensive philosophy is just chatter, it really is. Rose has dominated every PG he’s faced this year. I’ll take it one step further, very rarely has Rose not been the best player on the court in every game this year.
In less than 3 years he’s gained a jumpshot, a 3 pointer, better free throw shooting, and better defense. His maturation arc is why he has a chance at greatness. You can laugh, you can compare him to Iverson, you can say what you like but the facts are the facts. It took MJ 7 years to win 60 games, it’s taken Rose 3. He’s the leader of our team everything he’s said he’s going to do so far he’s done.
You guys love Howard, I get it and we love Rose. But there’s more to this game than being dominant and actually being on the court to be dominant is one of them. Howard not controlling his emotions says more about his immaturity than anything else. He’s a great player playing at a very opportune time for him to be great at his position. But like David Robinson who, who was flat out better, Howard may not be the type of player that can win a ring being hie team’s best player. Barkley was dominant, Malone was dominant…So what. It takes special skills to win that ring that go beyond dominance. Howard needs to grow the hell up first before anyone should speak of him like he’s the second coming of Bill Russell or even Shaq.
Hey Rose. I don't see the appeal!
by Dils on Apr 11, 2011 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Okay, Howard missed 3 games due to suspension.
And yeah, that’s not great. But he’s a better player in the other 79.
And again, if all “the best point guard in the league” can do is shoot the league average on a team that shoots the league average, you must have a really low opinion of the rest of the Bulls’ offense.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
You know whats average?
Missing 3 games out of 82 because of stupidity. That means on average Howard is more selfish, immature, and plain dumber than any other player in the league. While Howard is doing his team a disservice with his pattern of behavior, do you know what Rose is averaging in the last 10 games as he gets his team the 1 seed and ready for the playoffs? 27 and 8. That’s what winners do, they buck the average when it’s money time.
See it’s not about missing 3 games, it’s about showing a pattern of immaturity that leads to the league having to suspend you for 3 games. How do you think his teammates feel about his leadership? What you think Ryan Anderson was playing like Dirk Nowitski because of his blood thirst to beat the Bulls and to impress Howard?? Hell no. He did it cause he finally had a chance to show others what he had. A lot goes into leadership and Howard isn’t showing that. Dude he’s been suspended more than Ron Artest this year. how you like that average?
Hey Rose. I don't see the appeal!
by Dils on Apr 11, 2011 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Howard was not dumb enough to cheat on his SAT's, and if you cheat, you cannot be too bright.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions
lol
he missed three games this year and THAT is why he is slighted? Get real. Then Rose was a baby when Howard knocked him out twice. Real winners take the hit and get up and keep playing. That is sarcasm of course, but really, Howard missing games for being hot headed at times is akin to Rose recklessly driving the lane only to be injured. It is part of what makes them great, you take the lumps if/when they come.
I am made of bits of real panther so you know I'm good.
It was 2 games.
Jameer to D-Rose - "See you in the second round."
"As I was in the air, I was talking to him," Howard said to laughter. "Jameer, what did I tell him in mid-air?"
"Don't jump," Magic guard Jameer Nelson(notes) said.
"I don't know why he jumped," Howard said. "He wanted to be in the poster with me because we both wear [the same brand of shoes]."
"Honestly, seriously"
He is not the best PG in the league, and not even in the top 5.
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
(overall)
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
top 5 pg or player overall
hes definetly top 5 pg….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
Smh
8th in scoring, 99th in FG%, 84th in 3-point%, 10th asssts, 27th FT%, 50th in steals, 52nd in block. How does that even come up top 10 in the Association?
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
u havent answered my question
i can play ur game though, use those same stats, find me 4 pgs that are better in those stats
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
33 PG's have played in t least 40 games and average over 25 minutes per game.
Rose is 1st in scoring
18th in FG%
21st in 3-PT%
13th in FT%
6th in rebounds
10th in assists
22nd in steals and
1st in blocks.
Above average scorer, average otherwise.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 7:01 PM EDT up reply actions
right
but if you do this for each of the 33
my guess is cp3 and dwill aside everyone will be pretty much in the same situation, where they are really good in one category but then horrible or average in other categories. So even this wouldnt be the best way to rank them
if u want to go statistically, since your criterium utilizes all the stats found in a boxscore maybe its better to use per
in which case rose is ranked 2nd
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
I am not your personal statistician. Do some work yourself and prove me wrong.
I have shown the numbers and he is a productive scorer and a below average shooter.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 7:37 PM EDT up reply actions
PER overstates offense, downplays efficiency and defense.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions
true to an extent
but thats because per only uses boxscore stats which outside of steals and blocks dont really consider the progress on defense (unless you consider +/-, another stat with weakness) and the stats you used above were nothing but boxscore stats. The whole point of per is to create a singular number that takes all those numbers u posted and sort of standardize them. In other words, what u were posting was very similar to posting per except you were doing it in a more specific individual ranking, where its harder to see who has the upper hand. Per basically is designed (and if ur using just boxscores to compare players,) to make it it easier to compare an individuals ranking or impact on the boxscore.
so yea….2nd in pgs
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Apr 11, 2011 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
tl;dr
Dwight Howard is 2nd in PER your boy friend is 8th. You don’t want to argue Per.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Chris Paul
Top 10 every catagory listed above except blocks
10th ppg
8th FG%
9th 3-PT%
6th FT%
8th Reb
3rd assists
1st steals
20th blocks.
Don’t you wish you guy had that consistency?
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Overall, that's what the parenthesis clarified.
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
Yeah, probably top 5.
I’d definitely take Paul or Williams over him.
Probably Rondo, though it depends on what team you’re looking at.
Westbrook, probably — I’m not crazy about Westbrook, because he has the same problem as Rose (his offensive game is inherently inefficient), but his production is similar, he’s better at getting his teammates high-percentage shots, and he’s a much better individual defender.
And yeah, probably Rose fifth as an all-around player.
My concern with Rose is that, for all the hype, what we have is a player who is a league-average shooter in a league-average offense. He hasn’t shown the ability to help his team by getting himself or others high-percentage shots. Now, it’s possible he plays for a team that is so bad on offense that it’s a Herculean feat just to make them average. But I can’t say, looking at the Bulls’ roster, that they look THAT awful. A little badly constructed, maybe, but not awful.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Also, Westbrook is an amazing rebounder for his position
Aye, business is business and money is money i never said we were friends.
I love when
people type stuff that they no damn well isn’t true but do it anyway. Dwight Howard is the best Center in the league. You know why? Because it’s the truth. There’s no shame in keeping it real. Try it.
Hey Rose. I don't see the appeal!
Uhm, Derrick Rose is not a top-five player in the NBA.
Does he have the potential to be? HELL YES.
Is he? No.
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
by fwedo on Apr 11, 2011 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Lebron,Wade,Durant,Howard,Rose
And if I had to take anyone off that list to add Kobe it sure as hell wouldn’t be Rose.
Hey Rose. I don't see the appeal!
by Dils on Apr 11, 2011 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Just send a "taj face" when its over
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
1. Lebron
2. Howard
3. CP3
4. Wade
5. Durant
6. Kobe
7. D. Williams
8. Rose
Though 6-8 are interchangeable.
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
Oh eff, I even forgot Dirk. Yah, Derek Rose doesn't even touch the Top 5.
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
Then it would be? Rose has potential, but I would take a ton of players ahead of him.
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
If Orlando and Chicago switched places in the rankings,
Howard would have been the MVP. The MVP award is in part a team award.
Statistically, James is having a better year than Howard, and his team has a better record. Rose isn’t that far behind, and his team won the race for best record.
I really like Ryno's aggressiveness on the offensive side of the ball
Even though I couldn’t watch or listen to much of the game until seven minutes left in 4th quarter, it seemed like Ryan Anderson was attacking the rim a lot more and getting shots off in the post. When I was listening on the radio while driving to get to a television, I had admit I was quite estatic when Ryan had a nice flush in the 4th quarter.
His play on the offensive end yesterday was different then he has been playing for the last few months. For the last few months all he had be doing when he got the ball was immediately shooting a three pointer. But yesterday he was taking it the rim and being much more patient with the ball which was evident when he kicked the ball out to J-Rich for that three at the end of the game.
I think that Ryno’s value can be so much more higher if he plays some offense in the low post and attack the rim. Hopefully he continues to do this when the playoffs start. I think if he does, the transition between him and Rashard Lewis could be a lot smoother if not better because of Anderson’s offensive and defensive rebounding ability.
We all feel blessed that we were gifted Ryan Anderson in that trade with Vince.
He’s just going to get better. Great shooter and rebounder. He’s one of the best assets we have.
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
Me too!
Ryan has a very good read on ball bounce and where to place himself to get it. You can see his improvement day-to-day… It seems clear now that he’s becoming THE replacement for Rashard Lewis. And at 23… that’s is really good for the Magic’s future!
One thing I HAVE to say, though… and this one will get me in trouble with some of our fans: Ever since Ryno has become our no. 2 rebounder, it seems this has anoyed Howard to some extend. This is specially obvious when Anderson takes a rebound from Howard… and Howard gives him this frothy GLARE!
I just can’t believe the NERVE… and the immaturity!
Rhyno gets this rebound because he out-hustled Howard in THAT particular play… and Howard should just accept it. If he WANTS the ball that bad… SHOW it; hustle for it like you mean it! I’ve seen plays where Howard could have brought down the rebound IF only he had taken a step or two towards it. He does NOT! Same with some passes; he has to come OUT to meet the ball! He’s reluctant to do so…
Well, if this Magic Team is to succeed in the Playoffs; Howard has to stop this childish behavior and really play team ball. As far as team mates are concerned; STOP THE GLARING!!!
I actually think SVG wants everyone to clear out and let Dwight get the rebound.
I’ve heard him talk about the paramount order for his team is to get to the other side of the court and let Dwight gobble up the rebounds. I’m not saying that’s why Dwight gets mad, I just know that’s one of SVG’s philosophies.
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
Yes, I've read that...
But it’s not a very sound tactic: One person can’t hancle BOTH sides of the rim; you need on player on EACH side to CONTROL the rim, as Howard and the Magic have learned these past 20 or so games… We have been outrebounded for a LOT of those games. Either it’s that dreaded long rebound, where the Magic don’t have a player in position around the free throw area, or Howard is simply out of position… on the WRONG side of the basket. Howard and Ryno have to work in tandem!
Oh, the long rebound.
How I hate you.
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
Yeah. it's not sound.
The Magic are just the best defensive rebounding team in the NBA. So clearly that’s not working.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
I'm loving all these bulls trolls on here the past few days.
I hope these guys are on here in the playoffs when Rose ends up on his ass and has to leave the game again.
"Evan!
Unban me from the OPP!"...........David Polega
by AB's triple double on Apr 11, 2011 2:58 PM EDT reply actions
Its not cool man
to wish harm on someone NOT named Rajon Rondo
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Meh
Rondo hate is big at BaB
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Was it against the Bulls where Pierce busted out the wheelchair?
Arenas needs to hurry up and shoot himself (out of this slump).
Nah
But Rondo was a word i can’t say here during our series, and KG was a douche
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Man that was one of my favorite playoff series of all time.
Rondo was definitely a few words that shall not be uttered during that series. I think he’s matured a little since then. But still probably a jackass.
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
If it weren't for Rondo pimp slapping Brad miller
it would be over in 6
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
and the Magic would have been in the NBA Finals
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Apr 11, 2011 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I understand why.
Really thought he should have been suspended for the punch on Brad Miller
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
He's a Celtic
They wont suspend him, and throwing Hinrich into the scores table some thing Horry got suspended for but Rondo? Nah
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
It's NOT a wish to harm Rose...
It’s the harm he causes to HIMSELF! He’s reckless and a danger to himself… and to others.
Case in point: When he crashed into Ryan Anderson, Rose WILLFULLY went straight to his body to get the foul. Rose does this time after time… and the Refs REWARD him 80% of the time, which only encourages him more…
Well… sooner or later SOMEONE is gong to get hurt… seriously hurt… like out-of-the-game-for-the-series kind of hurt. Nobody wants that… on ANY player.
But watching Rose… it’s inevitable. Problem for him: This last time, it was 230-Lb not-all-muscle Ryno; NEXT TIME, it will be 270-Lb Dwight Howard, aka The Hulk. The result will be the same as the last two times Rose crashed into Howard last year: end-of-game; end-of-series; end-of-line. It’s Sayonara… Bye-Bye Birdie… Goodnight… Adios amigos, all rolled into one. Oh! … and end-of-road for the Bulls too!
Rose KNOWS this… I would be very, very carefull on his drives next time against the Magic. Indeed!!!
Oh... by the way...
It’s not like the Refs are going to call a Tech on Howard or anything; not the way rose creates the play and the way Howard plays him… because Howard simply lifts his arms up; it’s Rose who crashes into him. In one of those two plays, the Refs even called an Offensive foul on Rose… so it’s not like this will hurt Howard… not at all.
I dont think you watched a lot of bulls games
. Rose is just now getting his calls because he figured out to get calls without playing like a foul whore (unlike pierce) early this season he wasn’t getting any calls and its not like he’s getting superstar calls like wade or lebrick he’s getting legit calls most of the time. and at times still doesn’t get calls that are obvious.
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
Magic fans
it’s been real. Gl against the Hawks in the 1st round. Don’t beat them up too badly like you guys did last year. As Jameer said, see you in the 2nd round (hopefully).
I’ve wanted the Magic to win the last two seasons (when it was obvious the Bulls weren’t). So I don’t dislike your team at all. Actually had them as the #1 seed going into this season.
Peace.
The Chicago Bulls....have a young star, Derrick Rose, who must learn to live with the tearing down of his MVP candidacy as rapidly as he constructed it. - Woj
Well its been cool talking with you, most of you are cool
Beat the hawks so we have our rematch. Peace
Rose: Who in the blue hell are you?
Rondo: Well
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO YOU ARE!
fun!
THIS IS THE THREAD THAT NEVER ENDS,
IT JUST GOES ON AND ON, MY FRIENDS,
SOME PEOPLE START TROLLING IT, NOT KNOWING WHAT IT IS,
AND NOW THEY CAN’T STOP WANKING FOREVER JUST BECAUSE…
THIS IS THE THREAD THAT NEVER ENDSSSSSS!
I'm a girl.
by TheGiantSquid on Apr 11, 2011 4:10 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
At least most of the Magic fans (except Matty B) are united again!
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
It's time for this again:
If Redfield is OPP's best poster, and he's holding something back every night how can you say that doesn't affect OPP? He's their best guy! Your best guy leads! Your best guy sets the tone for everyone else! When Redfield cruises through game threads, makes dumb jokes, earns even dumber recs and disappears during debates (he doesn't even rank in the top 125 for insightful responses to trolls this season), you don't think that has anything to do with OPP's uneven season?
by Redfield on Apr 11, 2011 4:13 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
........I don't even
This whole thread is tl;dr
Otis Smith, what you've just done is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard of. At no point in your rambling, incoherent trades were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this blog is now dumber for having witnessed it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
by MoveThoseChains on Apr 11, 2011 4:21 PM EDT reply actions
yup
My eyes glazed over at about post 43.
by eltharion_doa on Apr 12, 2011 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Derrick Rose printed this whole thread and had it framed! He has it hanging next to his 6 MVP trophies.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 5:20 PM EDT reply actions
Derric Rose!
Is the 8th highest scorer in the NBA!
Is the 99th best field goal shoot!
Is the 84th best 3-point shoot!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 5:42 PM EDT reply actions
Is the 27th best free throw shoot!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Is the 88th best rebounder!
Is 10th in assists!
Is 50th in steals!
Is 52 in blocks!
MVP! MVP!! MVP!!!!
I have no idea why this wound up in multiple posts, I guess B_T_P_ is not the MVP poster.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Based on data from HoopData.com on 150 NBA players who have played 40 or more games and 25 or more minutes per game.
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Twitter."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 11, 2011 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I just want to say that this post makes me so proud of our community.
Starting with Evan, all through the comments.
I heart you guys. :, )
"(Dwight) Howard averages 23 points and 14 rebounds per game and is the defensive basketball equivalent of a guy carrying a bazooka during laser tag. No one wants to play with that kid."-Matt Moore
Derrick Rose deserves the award
The MVP is a team award, everyone knows that. If Dwight had willed a few more victories out of the Magic then I would have been adamant as his presence is undoubtedly more valuable to the Magic than any other player to his team. But barely getting home court is a big negative, regardless of the extenuating circumstances. I like Rose for MVP, he is the centerpiece of his team offensively, and he wreaks havoc on the opposing team’s set defense. The guy is the leader of the team that is the best in the conference and in contention for best in the league. The Magic did not even win their own division and are fourth in the conference. Despite the individual numbers, the team rankings are overwhelmingly in favor of Rose, and that is okay. MVP honors doesn’t equal playoff success…
I am made of bits of real panther so you know I'm good.
Yep.
He’s the centerpiece of the Bulls’ league-average offense.
He’s not the centerpiece of the Bulls’ league-best defense.
Sums it up in a nutshell.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Like I said below
Everyone knows the MVP race is based off of the best teams’ best player. The Magic didn’t finish high enough for Dwight to win based on past precedent. No amount of stats are going to change that fact. I am a Magic fan, but the bottom line is the MVP isn’t just personal stats, which Dwight wins with his defense and offensive ability opposed to Rose’s offensive only attributes, but the team’s achievements are relevant as well. For this reason Rose should win, his team played better this year by far than ours. Winning 60+ games as a team with one guy being their only real play-maker is an awesome feat, stats be damned.
I am made of bits of real panther so you know I'm good.
The Magic had the second best record in the NBA last year
And were DESTROYING teams in a way unheard of. Best offense and best defense. Dwight finishes fourth in the MVP, while Durant on an 8th seed finished 2nd. Media hype has a lot to do with it. Durant is better this year, his team is better this year, yet he is not getting a sniff of MVP talk. Media hype. When you live in a big market it is not easy to understand what small markets go through. Case in point, two years ago we were killing the Cavs in the ECF, and were heading home for Game 6. Only Charles Barkley picked us to close the game out. That’s it, that’s the list. You obviously defend your guy, but yo go by intangibles basically as the reason he is the MVP, as if NONE of the other MVP Candidates have any intangibles. Wasn’t Chris Paul a suprme leader three years ago? Wasn’t Dwight praised for sacrificing to help the team, now he is questioned why he defers? Move to a small market, root for the small market team, and then watch ESPN and see how you would feel as well.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
by Mateo9399 on Apr 12, 2011 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Durant's not in a big market.
Neither was James in Cleveland. Neither is James in Miami, for that matter.
Miami is a huge market.
Don’t confuse terrible fans with market. Miami is a major city. But still Durant and OKC were a nice story last year and that is why Durant got love for 2nd in MVP.His team is having a better season this year. Not even close to whiffing MVP talk. And LeBron is the best player in the world. He could play in Wyoming and the whole world would watch.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I agree
Dwight should have won the MVP last year. I think he was better last year.
Its not like Howard has taken this enormous jump.
Its unfortunate but we live in a new and shiny is better society right now Rose is new.
Howard has done is before and will continue to do it.
Chris Paul was insane a couple of years ago and that season he had exceeds Roses by a lot. He has however taken major steps backward while Rose has taken steps forward. I think CP3’s best days are behind him.
this is such a weak MVP year that it seems like a slight to not give Howard the MVP.
What about Dirk? He has carried his team more than anyone. He hasn’t received coverage.
ESPN is biased and I think a lot of writers write overly positive on Rose.
Its tough for a Big Guy to win MVP Garnett got passed over a couple of seasons. Its a beauty contest and holds no real meaning if it was for the best player LeBron would win it every year.
I live in Houston so I know how you feel Houston doesn’t get a sniff of coverage from ESPN.
Click this link
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&type=totals&per_minute_base=36&lg_id=NBA&is_playoffs=N&year_min=&year_max=&franch_id=&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&height_min=0&height_max=99&birth_country_is=Y&birth_country=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos=&qual=&c1stat=pts_per_g&c1comp=gt&c1val=23.&c2stat=trb_per_g&c2comp=gt&c2val=14.&c3stat=blk_per_g&c3comp=gt&c3val=2&c4stat=fg_pct&c4comp=gt&c4val=.55&c5stat=&c5comp=gt&c6mult=1.0&c6stat=&order_by=ws
No one has ever had the type of season Dwight has had. I even rounded down and shaved some points of his FG% for you.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Good point.
FG% is what does it there.
So in your opinion this is the best season Dwight has ever had?
If this is his best season then yes he should win the MVP.
Yes this is his best season
Also FG% matters. What if Dwight took as many shoots as everyone else. You are going to penalize him for keeping teammates involved? You can not have it both ways buddy. The dude is going to end up shooting 60% from the field.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I don't really think the Bulls winning
The worst division in the NBA is a reason Rose deserves the award more than anyone else, nor do I think anyone even cares.
by eltharion_doa on Apr 12, 2011 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Dude get real
They are the second best team behind the spurs in the entire NBA… Give credit where it is due. Yes their defense is superb and that along with Rose’s ability to break down defenses and wear them out with his constant dribble penetration makes this team a great contender just like the Iverson led Philly team. The only people that don’t ‘care’ about that major team achievement is biased or doesn’t want to face reality. The Bulls have played better than everyone except the Spurs in the league. Their best player is Derrick Rose. He does much more for the Bulls than anyone does for the Spurs. He wins. It may not be fair to Dwight, but following past precedent, that is what will happen.
I am made of bits of real panther so you know I'm good.
I'm not demeaning them
I’m just saying their division is awful and nobody cares that they’ve won it.
by eltharion_doa on Apr 12, 2011 7:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Have you all seen
Basketball-Reference.com’s NBA MVP Award Tracker? Here’s what it does:
The NBA MVP Award Tracker ranks candidates based on a model built using previous voting results. This list does not represent the opinion of this site. Rather, these are the players that the voters are likely to target.
It ranks LeBron James number one, Derrick Rose number two, Dwyane Wade number three, Pau Gasol number four, and Dwight Howard number five. So if it isn’t Rose, there are three other people who, by traditional standards, should get it before Howard. And of course if you want to throw traditional standards out the window, then James still has better stats than Howard.
What I find interesting about this list is the ranking of Pau Gasol. He was even higher on the list before the Lakers had their losing streak. Yet I went to Silver Screen and Roll and not one Laker fan thought Pau Gasol was the MVP of that team. Not one. To me, this is the strongest evidence that stats aren’t everything. No one who follows the Lakers thinks Pau Gasol is their MVP, even though his stats are better than Kobe’s. I wouldn’t be too quick to dismiss that as nonsense. I’m just not yet sure that basketball stats can measure everything yet.
by Tim S. on Apr 12, 2011 6:46 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Yes that is true.
Winning is taken in to consideration when it comes to MVP. Again, we don’t hate Rose, we hate the voting system. In a league with 30 teams, Orlando is 7th or 8th best. That is the only reason not to give it to Howard??
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
He can't score from the perimeter in isolation
If we’re being 100% honest, that’s the reason Howard isn’t getting it.
by eltharion_doa on Apr 12, 2011 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions
i kinda wrote a bit about this above
but the worth of a big man vs the worth of a perimeter player might be a way to look at the concept of ‘value’.
I think ever since the hand chek rule was created the shift of power went from big men to per. players mainly because per. players really cant be touched. Then theres the idea of creating for others, while yes howard does create for others by attracting a double team, the shot he creates for others (especially the magic) are harder jumpshots, where a per. player like wade, rose, lebron, and even durant can create easy layup opps or close range shots for their team mates.
If we look down the list only one player has been mvp as a big man like howard, and that is shaq.. Kevin garnett, tim duncan, and dirk nowitski all were big men who can take their game out to about 20 feet, and that added a lot more value since it opened things up for their team mates to get easier shots.
Shaq might have been a traditional post player compared to duncan and kg, meaning no jumpshot, but he still had almost twice as many assists as dwight does this year (3.1) while also havinig more points (29.7) and similar impact on both ends of the court. He was a better definition of dominating than dwight howard.
But aside from shaq and those bigs with jumpshots (karl malone is also in their) the mvp has gone to perimeter players.
This is probably the biggest reason people dont want to give the vote to dwight or big men in general, because they dont start out with the ball, and despite all the attenntion a guy like howard can attract, it obviously has not made his team better since they are forced to shoot long range shots which are harder to hit at a consistent clip. If howard played alongside ray allen, its very possible things would be different, and the factor wouldnt just be his individual play but the teams wins. But its hard to say howard is the most dominating player since his team is in 8th place overall in the rankings.
To be perfectly honest, without howard, i still think the magic would be in the playoffs, perhaps the 8th seed (id assume 7th though) but certainly still in the playoffs. I think if you took rose off the bulls and howard off the magic, they would be fighting for the same playoff spot, but its just a greater fall from the top than the middle
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Apr 12, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Shaq never has nor will ever play defense like Dwight
Blocks do not equal defense. Dwight plays PnR defense, individual defense, team defense LIGHT years ahead of Shaq. There is a reason Shaq was never in consideration for DPOY and Dwight has won it 3 years in a row and probably for the next decade.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Which is what is wrong with it
Dwight is the best offensive big in the league and the best defensive big in the league.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
would not say he is the best offensive big, I would take llama's offense over Dwight's
Arenas needs to hurry up and shoot himself (out of this slump).
Also I would stay he is the best big offensively
Because he shoulders the responsibility offensively and defensively. Their is no other offensive center who does what he does defensively and no defensive center who does what he does offensively. I think Evan did an article recently describing him in the post as the best post player currently in the game.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I'd take Howard's offense over Gasol's.
How many games does Gasol get doubled? How many wide-open looks does Gasol get near the basket because 10 eyes are on Kobe?
"I never look at the points," Howard said. "Rebounds and blocks are what win games for me."
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
Gasol is better than Howard offensively. Period.
But Dwight is still much better player overall.
If you wanna give some credibility to your thoughts, you might wanna cut on arguing every single thing that doesn’t go Howard’s way. So, the guy is not the best offensive big in the league, so what? He is still the best big in the league. Don’t you think that’s plenty?
Gasol has more tools
But I would take Dwight’s power and atheletsism(spelling?). I see what you mean though. Most skilled big man. But Dwight in the post is devastating.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I'm not sure it is that clear cut in Gasol over Howard offensively
At the rim Dwight shoots a higher percentage (75.8% vs 69.6%) and assisted less often (55.4% vs 59.7%).
At 3-9 feet Dwight shoots a slightly higher percentage (45.2% vs 43.1%) and assisted more often (46.8% vs 35.1%)
At 10-15 feet, Dwight Howard shoots a slightly lower percentage (40.2% vs 43.3%) and is assisted more often (48.6% vs 43.3%).
Of course, they play different positions so they should be scoring differently at different locations, but even out to 15 feet, the numbers in no way indicate that “Gasol is better. Period.”
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
by EnnBee on Apr 13, 2011 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
except that he isn't better offensively than him.
I gave reasons why I feel Dwight is better, your argument is basically “because I said he is, so he is.”
"I never look at the points," Howard said. "Rebounds and blocks are what win games for me."
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
This is why my fellow Magic fans are up in arms
No one alters a game more than Dwight overall counting his defensive prowess. I also agree that it is hard to measure one person’s effect on defense unless you have watched the games, so I digress that is why I agree with Rose being the MVP.
I am made of bits of real panther so you know I'm good.
I think
You’re massively underrating Carlos Boozer, Noah and Deng.
by eltharion_doa on Apr 13, 2011 2:12 AM EDT up reply actions
Do you think that's why Pau Gasol gets no respect?
I would actually buy that explanation if I could find even one Laker fan who would agree.
Gasol will never win because of Kobe.
I love Kobe, but he has never won without an elite big.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Dwight Howard is the MVP
Check this out
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=19413
Jameer to D-Rose - "See you in the second round."
by Shadyka on Apr 12, 2011 9:01 AM EDT reply actions 4 recs
This is why Magic fans get angry
I like how Hollinger says
Thibodeau’s ability to prod and push his young team was a huge factor in their unexpectedly rapid success
but neglects to give any credit to Rose for being the clear leader of the team buying in to Thibs’ message. I mean, I do think the guy is consistent in giving statistics the "trump" over anything else (intangibles, wins, etc), but he seems to completely ignore everything else.
Imagine if Dwight Howard had Rose’s approach and mentality. How much better would he be?
You telling me that Dwight has not bought into SVG’s system? Are you kidding me? The Magic philosphy is defend and rebound. What does SVG reinforce? Defend and Rebound. What does Dwight say the team needs to do in order to win? Defend and Rebound. What does Dwight do on the court? You guessed it Defend and Rebound. Every single MVP candidate, with LBJ possibly being the exception, buys into what their coaches preach. That is why their teams are great, and why they are MVP candidates.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I think even James listens to his coach
Spoelstra wouldn’t have lasted the season if James was ignoring him.
by eltharion_doa on Apr 12, 2011 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions
Listens and fully buying into are two different things.
Wade buys into Spo. I think LeBron does, but sometimes he just does his own thing and not what play the coach has called. I have seen watching the game.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
its impossible to measure
who knows who has credit for winning? Is it cause Rose buys in to Thibs system.
If Dwight played hard and gave 110% would the Magic have a 60 win season.
I don’t think so. The Magic are broken right now and I don’t see an easy fix for them hopefully anderson continues to improve. Nelson becomes a halfway decent pg .
If things don’t change for this team you might not make it out of the first round.
by houstonbull on Apr 13, 2011 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions
How do you give 110%?
That’s just stupid
[insert clever signature here]
by nastynate2012 on Apr 13, 2011 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions
that was my point
Dwight is playing at a high level already 110% would be impossible.
I disagree with Simmons in that Dwight has to put up legendary numbers I don’t think he can.
The problems with your team are not Dwight but having schmucks like Arenas and trading away Gortat. having an injured Reddick hurts as well.
You should have also kept Lowry and not have traded away for Alston.
I think the Hawks will beat you. This one of the weakest Magic teams in the last four years,.
We never had Lowry. Ever. At all. Seriously.
I think the Pacers will beat you. This is the weakest Bulls team that is a title “contender” I have ever seen in the last 20 years. See what I did there?
Also in case you missed it
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&type=totals&per_minute_base=36&lg_id=NBA&is_playoffs=N&year_min=&year_max=&franch_id=&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&height_min=0&height_max=99&birth_country_is=Y&birth_country=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos=&qual=&c1stat=pts_per_g&c1comp=gt&c1val=23.&c2stat=trb_per_g&c2comp=gt&c2val=14.&c3stat=blk_per_g&c3comp=gt&c3val=2&c4stat=fg_pct&c4comp=gt&c4val=.55&c5stat=&c5comp=gt&c6mult=1.0&c6stat=&order_by=ws
No one has ever had the season Dwight has had.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Sorry
I thought you did. I mixed up who got them from the rockets.
I take the point on Howard give him the MVP.
I think he has carried your team. he is the most valuable. I think the magic have had stronger teams. Your chances of losing to the Hawks are way greater than our chances of losing to the Pacers but it could happen.
Magic will not lose to the Hawks.
Hawks have no number 1 franchise player, no coach, no direction, no fans, no heart, no passion(except maybe Smith and Horford.) and bring nothing to the table. Yes it was cute that they won 3 out of 4 games this season. The Hawks have been blown out by 20 at home something like 5 times this year. Yeah they will win.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
its going to be tougher than people think though
The hawks are weird team and to think they will just roll over is assuming a lot. This is the only series in the East I think will go past 5 games.
and besides the no coach part they had basically the same team last year
Its going to be a tough series. Collins and the Hawks play hack a dwight which seems to work pretty well on frustrating Dwight.
4 game sweep
Some people thought Orlando would lose to Atlanta last year.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I'll take hawks in 7
Its going to be a war.
lol!
tbh I just hope we(Bulls) make it out of the first round.
I would definitely rather see the Hawks than the Magic.
at least your team has fans (I don’t understand why Atlanta is so ho hum about sports teams if Houston had a team like the Hawks the place would be packed every night and Miami should never get another prosports team.)
Atlanta cares about football.
They would care about the Hawks to, except they are not worth watching except for Horford and Josh Smith. And Jordan Crawford some nights. The fact that they put the franchise on the shoulders of Joe Johnson shows you what type of management they have.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Just to let you know
Jamal Crawford is the one that is on the Hawks, Jordan Crawford was traded to the Wiz. And Horford and Josh Smith could both be franchise players, if they were actually playing their position. Horford played PF in college next to Joakim, Josh Smith is far more natural at SF then PF. The Hawks are just an unfortunate team that is playing out of position and strapped themselves with overpaying a player (which they had to do to keep him there).
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
Meant Jamal
Recently had Jordan on my fantasy team that is why I put his name there. Also, Horford and Smith are not franchise players. I love both, but they are not franchise players. Dwight, Kobe, Dirk, LeBron, Rose, Paul, Wade, Durant and now Aldridge are franchise players. They are both very good players. But you wold not build your franchise on Horford or Smith. And yes I understand they play out of position. Start Zaza or Collins. Simple fix. And no they did not have to keep Joe Johnson. Insert Jamal and keep a good cap situation. Let someone else overpay for Joe Johnson.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
its easy in hindsight
but the Bulls community was in an uproar over not keeping Ben Gordon.
The Johnson deal will kill their flexibility in the future but I think the new cba deal will let teams get out of the more unfavorable deals.
The Hawks had to pay JJ or else they would lose what little fan support they had plus it would be tougher for them to sell a losing player.
Then they were really stupid.
Because then they could have made a push for hometown Dwight to pair with Josh Smith. Again it is that easy. Also Bulls SHOULD have kept Gordon. But not at that price. They made a smart business decision. Hawks should have done what the Bulls did.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Er no, you just haven't watched enough Bulls games with D Rose and Ben Go on the court at the same time
I’m a Ben Gordon fan, but he was a ballhog, didn’t put as much energy as he does into defense, and what came off as a sense of entitlement, there were plenty of times where Ben Gordon and D Rose are on the fast break together, and Ben Gordon just goes for the layup instead of an easy pass.
You hear a crap ton about intangibles and chemistry, well Ben Gordon would’ve been detrimental to this Bulls teams chemistry. Of course, we have no way of knowing that but just looking at how Ben-DRose worked together under Vinny Del Negro, we could educationally guess that it wouldn’t have worked out so well.
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
Gordon is better than Keith Bogans.
I am sure he would have listened to Thib’s. But again they made the right decision not to sign him to a ridiculous contract.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Agreed, agreed, and agreed
But 62-20 (or 61-21) is pretty damn good with Keith Bogans, and I don’t think I would take the risk of adding Ben Gordon to that team. But it would be stupid for me not to admit that BG7 could be damn good on this Bulls team.
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
If Alridge is now a franchise player,
I am sure Horford and Smith can easily become franchise players, they are both younger then 25 (Smith might be 25 or 26). I agree with you, I don’t want an argument, it was dumb for them to have to pay Joe Johnson, but the Atlanta franchise has had a hard time selling their product, whether that be ticket sales, tv shares or jersey sales.
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
Horford is no growing to be 6'11
And Josh Smith, as much as I love him, is a head case. Not legally, just a head case. Have you been watching Aldridge?? The kid a legit top 10 MVP candidate.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
LMA was picked by the Bulls and traded for Tyrus Thomas
Every Bulls fan watches LMA. Up until before this year, we referred to him as a jump-shooting ninny, because that’s what he was. Now, according to hoopdata, he attempts far more attempts at the rim and is making far more of those attempts. It is not like LMA magically got more talented, his game was changed to fit him more. That same possibility can happen to Horford (or Josh Smith, since he is a jump shooting ninny as well).
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
I know he was traded.
Yes he was those things. But he took losing in the playoffs personal, worked his tail in the offseason, got bigger and worked at his post game. Now all he should do is work on rebounding a little more and he will be legit top 5 candidate.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
All those things LMA did
Horford can as well. The question is if he will or not, since that is where so many great guys stop working, where great becomes elite.
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
Except he can not grow to be 6'11.
Horford is 6’9. People stop getting taller at a certain age. Horford is past that age.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I guess we will agree to disagree
If you think at the height of 6’11 it is ok for a Power Forward/Center to become elite.
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
Dwight is 6'11"
Not many dominate c’s below 6’11. And if you name a few(which there are none) they are an exception. Horford is a great PF. But he is not a franchise player. On a title contender, he would be the third best player depending on who your top two are. Aldridge can shoot from every where, although his 3PT% is suspect, and can score in the paint easier than Horford. Height makes a big differnece.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Actually, Dwight is only 6'11" with shoes on.
Barefoot hes is under 6’10".
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 13, 2011 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Karl Malone, Charles Barkley and Dennis Rodman
Would all like to have a chat with you regarding their Hall of Fame credentials, as they all do in fact list themselves under 6 ft 9 (or are 6 ft 9).
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
And they play PF.
Aldridge is a center now. Also, seriously do not compare Horford to the Mail Man, Sir Charles, and the best rebounder in the History of the game. Seriously you are embarrasing yourself. Horford on his best is not as good as Malone or Charles. And Rodman is a better rebounder by 100000000000000. I am not saying he is a great player. He is not a franchise player. Nothing is wrong with that.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Again, I can't believe we are arguing this
Horford is playing out of position, once again. He could be a franchise POWER FORWARD. It is Horford’s fourth year in the league, and he’s been playing out of position. I’m not even arguing that he is a franchise player, right now. All I have been saying is he has the talent to be a franchise player and needs to develop another element to his game, like almost all great players do. LMA made the jump from Great to Elite this year, why can’t Horford do the same next year? To basically assume he won’t, right now, is ludicrous.
And just to let you know, in the fourth year, those players weren’t hall of famers yet. They all still needed to develop and get better.
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
Basketball-reference has Horford listed at 6'10
So I guess this whole argument is moot
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
If he plays in shoes, 6'10 is close enough. Other than Chris Duhon, most guys do play in shoes.
Predraft Measurements
Height w/o Shoes 6 ‘8.75"
Height w/shoes 6 ’9.75
Weight 245
Wingspan 7’ 0.75"
From DraftExpress.com
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
"They say that nobody is perfect. Then they tell you practice makes perfect. I wish they'd make up their minds." -Wilt Chamberlin
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 13, 2011 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Bulls fans do not believe in stats remember?
Only ones that favor Derrick Rose.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
He could not be a franchise Power Forward
Barkley 4th season-28 ppg 12 rbs, and 5 assists
Malone- 29ppg 10 rbs
Yes they were HOF by their fourth season. Horford is just not as good as those guys. He does not have the talent to be a franchise PF. KG is done and still having just as good a season. And yes I understand that he plays out of position, but if there are no great Centers to match up against Dwight, why doesn’t Horford dominate the PF’s pretending to be Centers now and days. Horford can be a top 3 player on a title team, but that team would need an elite passing PG. As in if Atlanta was smart and drafted Chris Paul when they had the chance that would be Chris Paul’s team with Joe Johnson and Al Horford and Josh Smith as its next best players in that order. Horford does not make players better. He does not make the game easier for everyone around him. That is why he is not a franchise type player.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Blake Griffin is a rookie and already a better player.
It usually does not take that long to find out who franchise type players are. Aldridge took a little longer, but that is because he didn’t put the work in the offseason until last season. He did, now he is a franchise player.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
What.....?
The one thing that you just said for Aldridge (he made the jump in his fourth to fifth year), why can it not be the same for Horford (it’s his fourth year)? It is a bit to early to write him off like you have.
A Bulls fan is having to defend a Hawk, come on man. Don’t write off Horford just yet, as Aldridge has proven. What is so hard about this?
Bears. Bulls. White Sox.
Am I saying Horford is terrible?
If I have please put it in a quote. Horford is a GREAT player. He is not a FRANCHISE player. James Worthy was a great player, but was not a franchise player. Am I Horford is a bust? The Hawks made a great pick. He is a great player. He works very hard. He is not even the best player on the fifth best team in the east. Which title contender does he go to and instantly becomes their best player? Which team in the West top 8(go ahead and throw Phoenix and Houston for that matter) does he go in their and become their best player? Not one single team. He would not be the best player on Indy or Philly or New York either. Hell New York has two better players and they are a worst team than the Hawks. Do you see what I am saying? He will have a great career. Hopefully he ends up on a better team with better management. But he is not a franchise player. Gasol, Odom, Griffin, Bosh, KG, Aldridge(although he is a center now) STAT, Dirk, Boozer, are all better players. Dude no one is destroying his career. You just have unrealistic expectations for him.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
wonderful.
You have proven beyond reasonable doubt that you no nothing when it comes to basketball or the Orlando Magic. Kindly see yourself out.
"I never look at the points," Howard said. "Rebounds and blocks are what win games for me."
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
I love how this thread just won't die
and my love I mean I’m tearing my hair out over it
I'm a girl.
y?
all you have to do is not look at it, its pretty low on ur homepage now as well….ur the one purposely clicking to look at the comments…no one is forcing u to
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
and you sound like you make snap judgments over the internet!
:D
I'm a girl.
by TheGiantSquid on Apr 13, 2011 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions
he eats rice krispies, too!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 13, 2011 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions
This thread is close to 600.
I love it. And it is not a Bass vs Anderson war.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Obviously Ryan is better than Brandon!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 12, 2011 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
How about Bass is better than D-Rose?
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
Quote of the Week: "Humans only use twenty per cent of their brains, and the other eighty percent is what winds up on Blog-A-Bull."
"We can't win at home. We can't win on the road. As general manager, I just can't figure out where else to play." - Pat Williams, Orlando Magic general manager, on his team's 7-27 record in 1992-
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Apr 12, 2011 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions
OT: According to "Dr." Jack Ramsay, Keith Bogans should be DPOY
Aye, business is business and money is money i never said we were friends.
So, I'm watching the Spurs game and it got me thinking...
“Gosh, this team sucks without Tim Duncan, maybe he should be MVP.” But seriously though, Skip Bayless would vote Duncan for MVP before he ever votes Howard MVP, that’s how much he hates Dwight.
Dwight's watching you! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Dwight Howard: Strong as an ox, swift as a gazelle.
Then why does he always criticize Dwight?
And why did Bayless have LeBron #1 and Kobe #2 for his MVP candidates?
Dwight's watching you! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Dwight Howard: Strong as an ox, swift as a gazelle.
by GameManager on Apr 13, 2011 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions
He gets frustrated with Dwight when he watches a game like what he did against the Knicks a few weeks ago
But then only scores 14 points against the Heat earlier this month. Either way, those two guys are legitamate candidates for MVP. I could understand cases for both players. Kobe is Kobe. He is the closest thing we have had to Jordan since Jordan. And LeBron is far and away the best player who walks this earth. Its not like he had Glen Davis and Tony Allen one and two on his MVP.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
True...
at least Bayless is not a complete tool like Ric Bucher.
Dwight's watching you! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Dwight Howard: Strong as an ox, swift as a gazelle.
I am just happy
were not debating whose better Beasley or Okafor
Okafor has never had a coach.
Would he better than Dwight? Probably not. But Okafor with better coaching would have been a much better player.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
NBA Playoffs Content Module
Related FanPosts on Orlando Pinstriped Post
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
Contact Us
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Finally, Shelvin Mack and Robert Pack have a dance dedicated to them (VIDEO)
- Create-a-Caption: Allen Iverson, superfan
- Kobe Bryant-themed Gotye cover song waxes wistful for ‘The Kobe That We Used to Know’ (VIDEO)
- After the city canceled its outdoor viewing party, Oklahoma City Thunder fans work to get it back
- Chris Kaman eats breakfast in room of death, plays Sasquatch, builds giant medieval weapon
