Orlando Magic 116, New York Knicks 110
Jameer Nelson scored 14 of his season-high 26 points in the fourth quarter, leading the Orlando Magic to a 116-110 win against the New York Knicks on Tuesday night. The Magic trailed by as many as 11 points in the second half, giving back an early 12-point lead in the second quarter as the Knicks rolled to a 37-15 edge in the period. But Quentin Richardson's defense on Carmelo Anthony took the Knicks out of their game, and for the rest of the game the foul line proved to be New York's only reliable source of offense. Dwight Howard had 30 points, 16 rebounds, and 5 blocks for Orlando, which got 44 points from its bench in a strong outing. Chauncey Billups and Amar'e Stoudemire poured in 30 apiece for the Knicks, while Anthony scored 25 on just 8-of-24 shooting.
As Magic coach Stan Van Gundy likes to say, the NBA is a make-or-miss league. In the first half, Orlando struggled from beyond the arc, missing three of their four three-point tries, which helps to explain their 11-point deficit. Once the Magic found their outside touch, though, they were in great shape, as Howard got almost whatever he wanted against New York's undersized defenders. But they needed more than just threes to work their way back into this game, which is where Richardson proved most helpful. He got the call due to Hedo Turkoglu's ejection in the second period and wound up playing 17 minutes, providing chest-to-chest defense against Anthony.
And yet his contributions show up elsewhere, too. Richardson shot 4-of-7 from the floor for 10 points, his first time scoring in double-figures since December 4th, while pulling in 5 rebounds. Credit him for staying ready even after falling out of Van Gundy's rotation. This sort of effort tonight is what Orlando envisioned when it signed him to a four-year contract in July.
| Team | Pace | Efficiency | eFG% | FT Rate | OReb% | TO Rate |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Knicks | 100 | 110.0 | 41.3% | 45.3 | 22.9 | 9.0 |
| Magic | 97 | 119.6 | 58.0% | 52.2 | 22.9 | 18.6 |
| Green denotes a stat better than the team's season average; red denotes a stat worse than the team's season average. | ||||||
The less that's said about the Magic's second quarter, the better. New York shredded them in the period, as I pointed out, and had plenty of momentum at halftime. The Magic missed shots, the Knicks surged without Howard in the game, and took control.
Orlando's offense stirred to life in the third, with Nelson knifing through the lane for easy scores or to set up teammates; he's really at his best against teams like New York which don't have shot-blockers to deter his penetration or bother his finishes.
Richardson and Ryan Anderson set the tone for the Magic's comeback to continue early in the fourth at the offensive end. The two hit back-to-back threes, followed by a Richardson layup as he posted up the smaller Anthony Carter, and another three from Anderson to give Orlando a 90-88 lead. At this point, it became clear the Knicks simply don't have the defensive wherewithal to handle the Magic's offense, and the concern for Orlando became limiting the Knicks at the other end.
They did that to great effect, except when fouling, which proved to be often. The teams combined for 97 foul shots tonight, the highest single-game total in the NBA this season, as the officiating crew refused to "let the players play," so to speak. Billups did most of his damage here, baiting Nelson into silly fouls. But Magic fans can forgive Nelson for them: some of the calls were iffy--as were the some that'd later go against New York, I hasten to add--and Nelson scored 11 straight Orlando points later in the period with two layups, a long two-point jumper off the dribble, two foul shots, and a deep three in Billups' face. Those two always seem to enjoy going at one another, and both turned in brilliant performances because of it.
We learned a few things about the Magic tonight. First, and most importantly, is they stuck with it, displaying the sort of mental fortitude, engagement, and willingness to work hard that guided them to the NBA Finals in 2009 and a 33-8 finish to last season. It might've been easy for them to fold, and I imagine most Magic fans expected them to, following the disastrous second quarter. But they didn't.
Second, Richardson's still useful. He, not J.J. Redick, who didn't have such a bad game himself, earned the right to close the game out tonight for his defense and all-around tough play. In recent weeks, Van Gundy has given second-year combo forward Earl Clark the role of designated defender, but going with Richardson proved to be the right move here. He has the strength to tangle with Anthony, for one, but also has more to offer offensively than Clark. Clark's height advantage didn't pay dividends against Anthony early on, which to me indicates he's better suited to guard taller, more perimeter-oriented players like Dirk Nowitzki and Kevin Durant than drivers like Anthony. Plus, Richardson has more to offer offensively than Clark.
Third, Chris Duhon came to life in relief of Gilbert Arenas, who missed the game due to a sore left knee. Duhon didn't play spectacularly, as he finished with 2 points and 5 assists in 14 minutes, and the Magic's offense became discombobulated with him on the court; I'm willing to attribute some of it to the lineups with which he played, but it was telling that, after Anthony intercepted an awful pass and took it the other way for a dunk, Orlando had Turkoglu initiate the offense, with Duhon cutting to the weak side and standing in the corner, from then on out.
With three straight strong performances, Orlando appears to be turning the proverbial corner in its season. Good timing: it faces a back-to-back against the Miami Heat and Chicago Bulls this Thursday and Friday, and is one week away from embarking on a five-game, seven-night road trip.
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Hedo - no help
Does anyone still believe that the team plays better when Hedo is holding the ball, instead of Jameer running the offense??? Ridiculous plan post-trade.
Put Nelson in charge of the offense === it’s not too late.
Hedo has been playing great since the allstar break,
I dont know why you have to get on Hedo when he has been getting 8-10 assists a game since the break and besides the 0-4 last night, he has been shooting the ball very well. He is the best passer we have and is able to get in into Dwight with a man in his face because of his length.
I'm not sure of the actual numbers..but It seems to me that the offense runs better when turk is handeling the point..
"I got WAY too many cars in my driveway.."
Orlando Native(By way of Parramore)
by Mr_Major on Mar 2, 2011 10:36 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Hedo was always a secondary ball-handler.
Nobody’s giving him the ball INSTEAD of Nelson. They’re giving him the ball IN ADDITION TO Nelson.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Just a bad day for Turk
with his techs. I would like to see him shoot more 3s, otherwise I’m glad he’s back.
"A man has got to have a code." -Bunk, Season 1; Omar, Season 4.
Big win without Turk tonight.
We also learned that Clark is strictly a four now. He did decently against Melo, but he is a four when he has been effective so far this season. The problem comes when he shots. He has a nice looking shot, but man it is off. That can be fixed, so long term no big deal, but short term it is gonna limit his minutes. Although he did play good against Durant. Maybe Melo was too tough for him? We will find out. But winning with Duhon logging minutes is a good sign for the Magic.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Do you really believe he has a nice looking shot? I've watched him as a Phoenix fan
and now. Don’t get me wrong. I like the guy. But his shot, not so much. He doesn’t even have the fundamental of squaring himself to the basket. Lot of potential, but he has a tremendous amount of work to do on his shooting. Honestly, he’s so underdeveloped, I don’t really ever think he’ll be an effective scorer.
His fundamentals are bad yes I agree.
But with proper coaching, not exactly Phoenix Suns coaching staff, that can be fixed. What do you mean by effective? 20 ppg? If he can score 9-12 ppg off the bench while shooting ~45, 46% I can live with that. It depends on what they plan on grooming him into. A backup 4 or 3 or 5. But players can be taught. He is rawer than steak just packaged. But I have seen enough to believe that he really needs an offseason with the coaching staff. To me he has more upside than Bass. It depends on him. If he puts the work in, he could be better.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
He's not a 5.
And if he’s a 45-46% shooter, he’d better develop a 3-point shot (not likely) or become REALLY good at drawing and making free throws. Right now, we have a guy who could easily shoot 45-46% and still have a true shooting percentage below 50%.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
I say 5 because there are not many centers out there.
Obviously don’t want him guarding Bogut, Bynum, Amar’e or Nene. But most of the teams have terrible Centers. I think he has length to bother them.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
The general shift in the NBA away from traditional centers and towards combo PF/Centers is somewhat advantageous, it seems.
I guess that's the way the whole durned human comedy keeps perpetuatin' itself.
He's 6'9", 220.
He doesn’t even REALLY have the size to play power forward. He’s smaller than Bass or Anderson.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
He's not as wide, but he's WAAAAYYYY longer than Bass
I may be wrong, but he also seems to have bulked up quite a bit in just the 2 months he’s been here.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
I read he is up to 230 or 240 now.
If he is still 220, than that is the biggest 220 I have ever seen. Also he has the second longest wingspan on the team. He has bothered Durant, Gasol, Blake, and West all in the last few weeks.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
He's 6-10 and in the 240 range. Magic's strength-and-conditioning guy told the Sentinel a few weeks ago.
But I don’t see him as a C, no.
Don't see him as a center either.
Can just defend the non-good centers in the league for a little. If the Magic want to go small, SMALL ball
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
fun game. good win
ryan anderson should of got one of those charge attempts. The fouls were insane, so many on both teams. The knicks would be a scary first round thats for sure. But ignoring the kings loss which was pathetic, we have been playing real good, since the lakers. I want wins against the bulls and heat, but i feel a bulls win would feel good right now since they are rolling and the heat will be on 4 nights off, off a rough loss to the knicks.
I dont know why, but when Q Rich plays I suddenly feel like I'm watching the Magic from the past 2 years
Strong defense, commited, mean attitude, and big time opportune offense. He NEEDS to be the back up 3.
How good would we be with a second unit of Gilbert, J.J., Q Rich, Ryan/Clark/Bass??
Take out Arenas..
because he has done nothing to contribute to this team, outside of the Bobcats game.
SA the second game after the trade...
"In Otis We Trust"
by SpencerStorch on Mar 1, 2011 11:23 PM EST up reply actions
No...
I meant that Arenas would make the second unit worse because of his struggles. But since you mention Duhon at this point Arenas has played so poorly that Duhon isnt such a bad idea. But what would Duhon contribute to the team that Arenas cant. At least Arenas has shown that he can make some passes but his terrible shooting offsets that.
Poor Rafer
Kinda strange how his career disappeared like it did.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 10:07 AM EST up reply actions
Duhon is not the answer to the Arenas question
And Duhon was bailed out twice by extremely questionable foul calls while getting ripped at half court.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
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Richardon's been very poor offensively
That’s why he’s been benched – he was shooting worse than Barnes.
I enjoy seeing him out there and I think most Magic fans underrate him, but it’s really hard for him to get minutes when he can’t score.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 12:47 AM EST up reply actions
Q rich - start him
Q Rich is a starter. Defense wins.
Yeah
He has already been a starter and didnt do particularly well in that role. Back up might do him some good as opposed to warming the bench though, like tonight.
Hey we do need defense and the intensity..
What’s to stop him from going off from 3 if he starts.. He’s a NBA player, he’s gonna get out of the scoring drought..
Starter over who? Turkoglu?
It’s nice that Richardson had a good game, but I’d like to see more of that before even suggesting he get regular PT, let alone a starting job.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
JRich and Turk
Neither is contributing much. Do they start to avoid embarrassment to management?
Turk has been efficient lately.
He was injured playing on a bad knee is not fun.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
They start because they're quality players.
A momentary slump is one thing — and understandable, given that they’re still working their way into the offense. But they’re theoretically the best guys we’ve got, and we’d need to see more before making any panic moves.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
I'm not saying he should start
But it’s interesting that Redick’s actually passed Richardson in PER since J-Rich has been in a funk this month.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 3:00 AM EST up reply actions
In J-Rich's case, supposedly.
I love the trade that brought him there, but for the second straight time we acquire an free-shooting and high flying SG, he starts dud-ding it up in Orlando
re: J-Rich, on paper yes...
but, a very convincing argument can be made that JJ has outplayed J-Rich during his time here.
In what -- a couple months?
I love JJ as much as the next guy, and he’s been good for longer than a couple months. But you have to give Richardson the benefit of the doubt — he’s settling into a new team.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Over 30 games is more than enough time to “settle in”. Heck, that’s more games than most college basketball teams play in a season.
Really?
Look at Vince Carter last year — and he had the benefit of a pre-season.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
see my fanpost statistical support
for this proposition
Deserving win.
Good game for the Magic. Jameer must’ve liked APPLEs. Esp BIG ones. He ate them during the game.
Nelson really took the game over...
in the 4th and scored all but 3 of his points in the second half. Richardson filled in nicely for Hedo tonight and they hung in there and made the comeback. 3 game winning streak hopefully we can finally get our 10 game winning streak but we will have to get through some tough competition to accomplish that feat.
Amazing that we could still potentially win 59 games this year
Technically 60 but LOL it’s nice to dream…
Yeah, I was thinking about this
It is still probably going to be the first year since SVG has been here that the Magic have fewer wins than the year before, but the door isn’t closed quite yet.
1 game at a time.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
Really wild swings from quarter to quarter in this game
The Magic shot 11 of 14 (78.6%) in the first quarter, then had an awful second quarter, shooting just 3 of 17 (17.6%).
The Magic shot 9 of 19 in the third quarter, and then put the game away in the fourth quarter by shooting 13 of 19 (68.4%), including 5 of 6 on three pointers for a 4th quarter eFG% of 81.6%.
The Knicks shot just 4 of 15 in the fourth quarter, but went to the FT line 19 times in the quarter, making 18.
For the first and fourth quarter combined, the Magic shot 24 of 33 (72.7%), including 6 of 8 on threes for an eFG% of 81.8%, while the Knicks shot 13 of 39 (33.3%), including 1 of 14 on threes for an eFG% of 34.6% during that same time.
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Mar 1, 2011 11:33 PM EST reply actions
Good Win!
Side note, Would it be the worst thing in the world for the Chicago Bulls to be the number 1 seed? If we play Atlanta in the 1st round do you guys think we can beat Chicago in a 7 game series without home court?
Thanks in advance to anyone who responds.
Excuses. Reasons you failed. No one wants to hear them.
by NO PITY IN TIMBER CITY on Mar 2, 2011 12:16 AM EST reply actions
IMO
if we are the championship team that we think we are. We can beat any team that comes our way. So IMO, it doesn’t really matter which team we play.
I agree but playing Chicago in the second round is a dream come true.
And here’s why. Chicago has not yet been anointed by David Stern as the heir apparent so that means we’d only have to play two series of 8 on 5. The Magic could possibly win two against the odds but I’m not sure Stern would let them win against Boston, Miami and LA. Call me a cynic but…
yeah, I think that would be ideal.
But either way, we’d have to go through Chicago & Miami/Boston. All are really good teams, so it doesn’t really matter the order.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
yeah that's why I typed Chicago & Miami/Boston as in, the winner of the Miami/Boston series.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
Agreed. No answer inside for Dwight. Rose cant stop Jameer just as much as Jameer cant stop Rose.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
When Nelson plays the way he did last night, he can best any PG in the leauge
Hopefully last night is a sign of things to come for Jameer the rest of the way and not a flash in the 2011 pan.
The Bulls would not be able to contain Dwight Howard at all
…even with a healthy Joakim Noah for the Bulls; Howard is just too strong for Noah.
That being said, Howard could not beat the Bulls by himself, as he scored 40 points the last time the teams met but the Magic still lost, as his teammates did not contribute very much. His teammates would need to contribute more, much like they did against the Knicks Tuesday night, with several Magic players having very good games to help out Howard.
The Bulls have a deeper team than the Magic, though. With Noah and Boozer both back healthy, and Luol Deng having a solid year, those three complement star PG Derrick Rose very well in the starting lineup, with Keith Bogans being the weak link, but Bogans plays only around 16-17 minutes a game. Plus, with Noah back, this really gives the Bulls’ transition game a big lift.
With dependable role players coming off the bench like Kyle Korver, Ronnie Brewer, Taj Gibson, C.J.Watson, Omer Asik, and Kurt Thomas, the Bulls depth is as good as any team in the NBA.
i think it would be an outstanding seven game series between the two teams that would be difficult, but not impossible, for the Magic to win without homecourt advantage. The Bulls have lost only four times at home this season, but one of those losses came against the Magic in a 29 point rout on Dec. 1st.
.
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Mar 2, 2011 12:45 AM EST up reply actions
how i wish boston/mia would play each other
bulls and magic would be a fun game to watch
what we do in life echoes in eternity
I don't think the Bulls would be worried of Howard.
They would be more concerned of the 3 pt shot.. They would force us to win with the outside shot.
Neither did the Knicks
But Orlando didn’t start winning until the perimeter players heated up.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
They don't have to be
They’re a vastly better defensive team.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
There
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
sorry, touchpad on Keyboard messed up.
The difference is the Magic shot terribly at the start against the Knicks. If they don’t shoot awful from 3 for 4 of the 7 games, they will win.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
What?
Magic shot 78.6% in the first quarter against the Knicks. Dwight scored 17. The Knicks run started when they sat Dwight.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
They shot poorly from 3, sorry.
They only attempted 4 threes. Only hit 1. That isn’t a normal outing for them. They also weren’t hitting their 3s until the middle-end of the 3rd.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
Ah
okay. Well, in the first quarter, they were 1-2, but that was because they were getting so many open inside shots that they didn’t need to shoot them.
I guess they missed two more at some point?
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
yeah, I think Richardson missed one and Clark airballed one at the end of the half
Not exactly definitive of anything, really.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
Still, it would've been nice if they had made a couple more in the second quarter.
Or at least had the personnel to attempt some open ones.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
And Chicago didn't win their last game against the Magic until they heated up outside
The Bulls shot almost 10% above their 3pt % for the season making 2.1 more than their normal number of 3s while the Magic shot almost 15% below their average and made half about what they do on average from distance.
Even more, look at the games this year. 2 games. Both in Chicago. Magic were on a B2B in one and had 1 day off before the other while the Bulls had 3 days off to prepare for each game. In those games, the Magic won 5 of the 8 quarters and 2 of those quarters were lost by 1 point.
The single quarter the Magic were trounced by the Bulls was the 3rd quarter of the second game. In that quarter, Bulls shot 10 of 13 from greater than 11 feet (including 3 of 5 from 3 point range). Outside of that quarter, the Magic outscored the Bulls by 8.
Also, in those 2 road games the Magic 49% and 47% from 2 point range while the Bulls shot 43% and 42%.
So, at this point, it seems safer to say that the Bulls are much more reliant on the outside shot to beat the Magic than the other way around.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
by EnnBee on Mar 2, 2011 12:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Good stuff.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
You're missing the point
Teams, at this stage of his career, are willing to chance Dwight going off alone and beating them – if they can shut down the outside shooters.
Whether or not the Bulls need to hit outside shots as well is irrelevant to the only point I was making – that Dwight can’t do it all himself. He needs the outside guys to hit shots and give him help.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
No team will win with just one player playing well.
The “strategy” of letting Dwight “get his” is such a gross over-simplification of how things play out. We can totally win a game pounding it into Dwight if he’s getting single-covered in the post the whole time. But we need those other players on the floor who don’t have as significant of an advantage over their defenders to play on the other end of the court. We have too many players who just have serious defensive lapses when they’re not engaged in the offense, and that’s not an excuse.
With Gortat and Pietrus gone, Q is the only player on the roster now besides Dwight who will play D when things aren’t going his way on offense. Maybe Duhon too, but ugh. If those guys still kept up their energy defensively while Dwight pours in 50 against the likes of Jermaine O’Neal or Juwan Howard, then we’d be fine. If Dwight is struggling with his offense for a game, then work the Pick-and-roll to death with Hedo and Jameer. That will open up things regardless.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
and Duhon only gets added to that group because he never has it going for him on Offense.
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
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we all love to see it
bulls is a very scary team but the least scary for our line up to handle
what we do in life echoes in eternity
Free throw shooting in this game
Chauncey Billups’ 18 free throws made was the second-most by a Magic opponent in franchise history, next to Allen Iverson’s 24 free throws.
The Magic attempted 50 free throws; this was the 15th time in franchise history that the Magic have attempted 50 free throws in a game, and the second-most in the Van Gundy era.
The Magic made 36 free throws; this ties for second for the most free throws made in a game by the Magic in the Van Gundy era.
The Knicks attempted 47 free throws; this is the second-most free throws attempted in a game by a Magic opponent in the Van Gundy era.
The Knicks made 39 free throws; this ties for eighth for the most free throws made by an opponent in Magic franchise history, and is the most made by an opposing team in the Van Gundy era.
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Mar 2, 2011 12:17 AM EST reply actions
This is the most free throws for an NBA game in over 4 years (February 2007)
Also, did you see the box score from the last time the Magic were in a game with a combined 97 free throws?
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199011200GSW.html
That’s right, Terry Catledge took 11 of them as he was a starter – along with Sam Vincent, Jerry Reynolds, Nick Anderson, and Greg Kite.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
Interesting... thanks for the link
What kind of jumped out at me was that Vincent was the starting PG, while Scott Skiles came off the bench and played just nine minutes. This was a month before Skiles set the all-time assists record in a game.
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Mar 2, 2011 4:35 PM EST up reply actions
I noticed the Skiles bench thing, too
Didn’t realize it was shortly before the 30 assist game. Weird.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
Thanks!
Chicago Bears... 2010 NFC Conference runners-up
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Mar 2, 2011 4:36 PM EST up reply actions
wow jameer!hahaha
qrich played well. hope he can start and use hedo as our sixth man. hedo would facilitate our second unit while gil would be our spot up shooter.
worried about d12’s minutes though. hope otis finds a back up C real soon
what we do in life echoes in eternity
Evan, Wasn't Q-Rich signed to a two year contract?
People stop this dance, Say damn this persons fascinatin'
We blowin' dro up in the air, You smell it?
That's the fragrance, I got the focus, got the heart
And I got the patience
4 years
Final year is a player option.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 12:55 AM EST up reply actions
finally, Jameer steps up. Like Eddy said this was 2009 Nelson
But great contributions from our bench, Ryan 4-5 from deep wow, and Q minimizing the Melo threat.
I’m glad Duhon doesn’t chuck it like Arenas, which meant more shot opportunities for everyone. and J-Rich is still sucking. Is it time to stop calling it a slump?
It's still a slump
It’s just a long slump and getting longer.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 2:59 AM EST up reply actions
its about as a slump as Vince's while here
J Rich needs to just put back to back above average games together at this point
I'm so happy about this win, that I'll even put up with having to watch Ducon in his
12:45 minutes of play. I knew Jameer would deliver. Can anyone find out what did Hedo say ?
Don't mind my spelling. I'm a Typo Master.
"Are you kidding me?!!?" in Turkish language
and still slapped him with a tech. I guess most refs now are multilingual.
JK
I don't understand Duhon
He looks like he’s forgotten how to play basketball at all.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 3:01 AM EST up reply actions
"Jameer is not a pick-and-roll PG"
Thanks, Dumb Poster On This Site That I Will Not Name. Cool stuff. Ryan was clutch. Q-Rich wasn’t perfect, but he sure did play his best game in months. Comparing his defensive effort to that of J-Rich’s or Arenas’ or even Hedo is just night and day.
Anyways, good win, especially since Duhon had to play. Right way to get the big week started.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
I hate ESPN
So I just happen to catch the 2 talking heads on ESPN’s d’bag and bigger d’bag I mean Mike and Mike in the morning and low and behold we have Magic coverage and I believe it was only because we played the Knicks. Anyway they start in on D12 comments about playing with the Nets . They went on to say that his comments are a clear indication that he is definitely on his way to either the Nets or the Knicks. Wow what a bunch of biased idiots. Jameer rocks and go Magic
Bizarre. Just heard that
Look in every series(except Miami) the Magic will walk in with the best player. And in a Miami vs Orlando series, they will walk with in with the best combo of player and coach. They can beat anyone. If the supporting cast does their part, the Magic can win any series.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
if they are the forth best, then thats fine
but they don’t deserve to be lumped in with the rebuilt unproven knicks and the rest of the middle
Exactly
I never understand why the Magic (and Dwight Howard) are always forced to “prove” something to the media. Of course, when they do it, they just move the line a little bit further away.
Why don’t the Knicks have to prove they can win? Why don’t the Heat have to prove they can win in the post season? Same with OKC. Why is it only Orlando that gets whatever the opposite of the “benefit of the doubt” is?
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
Because Orlando
Are 3.5-5.5 games behind the “big three” in the East.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
And the Knicks are how many games back of the Magic?
It’s not about getting “props” or being called a “favorite.” It’s about a routine story line from the media about the team (and especially Dwight Howard) that focuses on supposed weaknesses while completely ignoring any and all history of strengths and success.
There is nothing to do to change it, but it certainly gets annoying.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
The Knicks just added a top 20 player
A regular All Star, and combined that with one of the best veteran PGs in the NBA.
Orlando…got a good game from Arenas?
Orlando aren’t in the same category as the top three. You can argue that the Magic aren’t in the same category as the Knicks, either, of course – and I personally wouldn’t disagree – but “New York OK but not really as good as Orlando or Atlanta yet even though they beat Miami” isn’t an interesting story.
I think the Knicks do have to prove they can win – they’re not being talked about in the same category as Miami, Boston or Chicago except when TV hosts ask strawman questions for their analysts to shoot down.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed.
Look at the point differentials so far this year. The Magic are at +5.8 — very close to the Bulls, Celtics and Heat, and three points per game ahead of anyone else.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Excellent point except the Magic's differential is +6.03
Also, the Knick’s point differential is a whopping +0.4 and the Hawks are +0.9.
The Magic currently have the 6th best differential in the league but only 2 teams ahead of them have an equal (Celtics) or tougher (Spurs) strength of schedule.
Over the past 15 games (25% of the games played), the Magic are 4th in differential at +7.00 and none of those ahead of them have had tougher strength of schedule over those games (.497 for the Magic, .442 Mavs, .448 Heat, .477 Bulls).
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
Ah, okay.
I think I was looking at numbers from a couple games ago.
Still, the point stands: The Magic are outplaying their opponents around as much as those other teams are outplaying them.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
Seriously
Don’t pay any attention to ESPN. They’re only interesting in getting clicks and ratings.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 8:46 AM EST up reply actions
Actually the first take people put Orlando in their proper place. The third best team in the east
Broussard of all people was praising Orlando. Didn’t put them in the Finals, but still likes them. Skip says any team that has Dwight has a chance. And said we are infinitely better without Carter. Man he hates him
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Again, this is what's wrong with the NBA now
Fun game. Huge numbers by stars on both teams. Instead, let’s talk about free agency that isn’t even an option until after NEXT season.
Also, let me guess…they didn’t have time to mention Dwight explicitly saying yesterday that New York was nice to visit but it was “too cold up there.” Probably skipped over saying that Orlando is the most attractive place for him because “They have a sexy new arena, a beautiful franchise, nice banners around here and been in the top four in the Eastern Conference for the past four years.” Reporting that would have got in the way of the story they already decided to write and talk about.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
by EnnBee on Mar 2, 2011 11:06 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
People in New York
Don’t want to hear that they’re not getting a shiny new signing next year, do they?
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah I was gonna make a fan post or fan shot about that.
Dwight, I believe, REALLY wants to stay here. But he wants to win a title. I also like how he said you don’t have to go play with another all-star. He said you need a team. Love to hear that. This guy has become Kobe Olajuwon. Seriously. Do we all realize that Dwight has morphed into what we all thought he could be?
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I do every day. I will never understand the lack of respect he gets around the league, though
Seriously. He plays every game. Plays hard every game. Works to improve him game on both ends of the court every game. Always gives a good interview. Still, it never seems quite enough.
The sad thing is that you KNOW if he went to NY or LA, he would instantly be recognized for all of the things we already know he is. That is perhaps the most frustrating part as a fan.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
I don't think he will leave.
Those comments he made, to me, means he wants players to come to him, not he go to them. He is a true Alpha Male. I love him calling his teammates out. HE WANTS TO WIN. Wants nothing more than to win a title. He knows his team can get to the Finals. He has been there. He has more Finals victories than LeBron, Bosh and Melo combined. Which is one so makes you wonder about the other 3. But back to Dwight. Man he deserves the MVP. Imagine if took 25 shots a game like Melo or Rose? He would average 36 points. Obviously Shaq was a beast. But I would rather have Dwight. Scary part is, is that he has not even hit his prime yet. Very scary.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
It's incredible, isn't it?
Im down with OPP, yeah you know me!
http://www.twitter.com/JShannonhouse3
http://www.twitter.com/Amway_Get_Loud
Calling out his teammates to me shows how much wants to WIN instead of LEAVE
That is the Kobe part. But he has seriously turned into Hakeem 2.0. Chris Paul and Deron Williams, you guys listening??? You can now play with a more atheletic version of Hakeem.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I wouldn't say Dwight is more athletic than Hakeem.
Stronger and can probably jump higher, but Hakeem was lightning quick, more agile, and also a lot more coordinated. The guy grew up as a goalie in soccer until he was 15. They’re both athletic freaks, just in different ways.
"We just want to chill" - Chris Bosh.
Proud Jameer and Rashard apologist since '07
Wha about Duhon?
Couldn’t watch the game, when I saw he had 5 assists in 14 mins i thought he had a great game, but you are all saying he wasn’t good at all, how come?
Defense was all over him.
Had big rouble just trying to bring the ball up. I can’t believe I am saying this…..but the Magic missed Gil last night.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
For as bad as he appeared to be, he only had 1 turnover, and the team was +11 with him on the floor.
exactly..
I’ve said it before and will say it again…. To the amateur eye (which pretty much describes everyone on this board), Duhon doesn’t pass the “look” test, but he plays better than he looks. Hard to argue with 5:1 assist/to ratio, even if it didn’t look pretty while it was happening. I for one would MUCH rather turn back the clock and keep Gil in Washington and have Duhon as the backup pg. Can’t imagine the owners are happy paying Gil 5x’s what they pay Duhon for only marginally better performance.
I really do not want to lean on Duhon at all.
Look Gil is still better than Duhon. As I have always said you can’t go by either stats or eye test. You have to take both. Either way I still want Gil instead of Duhon playing.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I agree the numbers look better than the game when he was in
But the offense in the 2nd quarter managed a whopping 15 points. It was TERRIBLE. No movement. Bad passes. Out of sorts. Just awful.
A lot of that has to do with having Bass and Clark out there together, too, but Duhon was not doing anyone any favors running the offense at that point.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
15 points just makes...
the 5 assists that much more impressive. What that tells me, is that he was the only one getting the ball to others in a position to score. Everyone else wasn’t helping the “team” offense any. Duhon, heck, even D. Williams or CP, can’t make up for the fact that Bass is a black hole, Clark has no offense, J Rich can’t shoot his way out of a paper bag right now, etc.
Duhon had 0 assists in the 2nd quarter
Truthfully, he wasn’t the worst culprit in that terrible stretch run, but he did manage 1 assist, 1/2 FT, 1TO and a blocking foul in his 6 minutes between the 1st and 2nd quarters.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
I do feel like Duhon gets a lot of blame fdor stuff that has nothing to do with him.
Bass and Clark is a horrible frontcourt — and I like Bass. But Clark is unimaginably bad on offense, so putting him next to a limited scorer who doesn’t pass is no help for anyone. Just like earlier in the year, when you had him playing alongside that horrible Gortat-Bass-Pietrus combo. If you’ve got a bunch of guys who can’t score, or can’t/won’t make the simple passes, or in Clark’s case both, there’s a limit to how much you can do as a PG.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
I think there is some truth to this
The problem is that Duhon isn’t a threat to score himself so the defense can almost completely ignore him. He may not make a lot of mistakes that show up directly on the stat sheet, but letting the other team play 5 on 4 against the other guys in the 2nd unit is going to make it tough for everyone.
The plural of "anecdote" isn't "data."
Or 5 on 3 if Clark's out there...
That’s been baffling to me — Duhon’s refusal to shoot. He’s never been a good scorer, but he’s always been able to make open threes. This season, though, he won’t even take those.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
He will when he's playing a spot up shooter
But without Turk, there’s not really anyone on the second unit to get him the ball in the corner.
He obviously really doesn’t feel comfortable “popping” a jump shot off a screen, which is a big problem for the PG in Orlando’s offense.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 1:39 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed. I would live with an Anderson/Clark frontcourt long before I had to go to Bass/Clark.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
The way he was bringing the ball up looked like he was in a small tornado..
I was worried every time he brought the ball up. It was like the defense knew they could strip him.
watching duhon
and I couldn’t think of a worse NBA player. His turnover was straight to the other team and he almost comimitted another when he dribbled the ball of his foot. He was bailed out on a foul call against Douglas.
Its tough to watch NBA players that can’t contribute to anything. His assists were more because of the other players making plays (like JJ’s curls).
But, as at least we have a 3rd string PG. I guess thats all I can say.
"A man has got to have a code." -Bunk, Season 1; Omar, Season 4.
Well, if you judge players by how pretty they look on the court, you end up with Earl Clark.
I’m not arguing that Duhon is suddenly a great point guard — just saying that he might not be as bad as we’ve seen so far.
Give me the real second string: Bass and Anderson up front, Redick at the 2… Hedo at the 3? (Maybe even Quentin now.) See if he’s able to run THAT lineup, not some bogus lineup that nobody can do anything with.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
I'd rather see Turk with the third unit
Give Q-Rich 15 minutes with the first team.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 2, 2011 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
Please god no.
One game should not make him a starter. Nobody on Orlando gets Dwight the ball better than Turk. No one. No one is even close.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
I'm not saying start Q-Rich
Just bringing him off the bench with a different unit than an all reserve lineup.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 3, 2011 5:42 AM EST up reply actions
Duhon was absolutely horrible. But I guess that horrible in relation to death could be considered coming to life.
'Coach, Dwight is a nice guy. Dwight don't hit anybody. But Superman will knock the crap out of you.' - D12
by Eyriq the Red on Mar 2, 2011 10:23 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Two things I liked from last night:
1. Lack of a team-wide slump. In some of the past games it has seemed like the slump spread across the whole team (- Dwight). Last night, when some players faltered, others stepped up and got theirs.
2. Defense. Sure, it’s not consistent, but it seemed like there was more effort.
I guess that's the way the whole durned human comedy keeps perpetuatin' itself.
Great win
and it had so many different elements to it:
-Shawne Williams guarding Dwight? I know D’Antoni likes offense but good lord thats a horrible coaching decision.
-Jameer can’t play like this against Boston, but he can play this well against any other East team. He has to constantly be on the aggresive. Loved this game from him.
-Hopefully the NBA give Amare a flagrant on that foul on Dwight. Its sending a really bad message when he gets slapped in face and no flagrant. Amare was not making a play on the ball.
-Q Rich! Always a pro. I know I was pushing for Brewer, but Q has toughness that some nights this team sorely needs.
Great start to a tough week AND Dwight didn’t get a T when there was 5.
"A man has got to have a code." -Bunk, Season 1; Omar, Season 4.
He can do what he did against Billups against Rondo.
If Jameer scores, we are a better team.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Finally slogged through all these comments, and
I seem to remember making a couple posts weeks ago about how Duhon and Arenas are not very different in terms of stats and skill level. I agree with 3.3 above: a frontcourt of Bass and Clark is absolutely disastrous, so Duhon does get a lot of blame for things that aren’t his fault.
My favorite thing was seeing Quentin Richardson playing quality minutes. I dearly believe that he will be a valuable asset in the playoffs, and I’m happy to see him maybe start to get back some of his offense. He doesn’t need to do that much – just defend and knock down open shots – and he was doing it last night.
Otis Smith, what you've just done is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard of. At no point in your rambling, incoherent trades were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this blog is now dumber for having witnessed it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
I think he valuable to a degree.
Its all about matchups. I would rather have Q on LeBum LeChicken and Melo moreso then Earl. But I don’t mind seeing Clark on KG or Al Horford or Chris Bosh or Boozer. To me that would make either Bass or Anderson more of the backup 5. If Clark can limit shots to about 2-3 a game and that is it, I think he could be a huge asset. I don’t mind if he doesn’t even shoot. But at least pass it to him when he is running in transitition for easy baskets. Last night we found out what Clark is just like Evan mentioned. He can guard perimeter players, but right now does not have teh basketball moxy to guard the slashers. But Q can definitly help in the playoffs guarding a LeBron or Melo. Don’t think we need to worry about Melo. As it looks now, we have to worry about Marvin Williams and Joe Johnson, or Paul Pierce and Ray Allen. Not gonna worry about the ECF unless we get there for now. But Magic need Jameer to play like he did in teh second half. If they are going to let Dwight do his thing, then Jameer needs to get others involved. Jameer needs score, be aggressive, and get the others involved after he has got himself going.
Roll Bass and War Ryno for me
Well, QRich is a SF, while I see Clark as a PF.
The players you listed at the beginning are all SFs and PFs, respectively, so that makes sense.
Otis Smith, what you've just done is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard of. At no point in your rambling, incoherent trades were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this blog is now dumber for having witnessed it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
I cannot believe that anyone is seriously talking about putting Clark back out there on purpose.
Even if he were an All-Defensive candidate, which he isn’t, he is arguably the worst offensive player I’ve ever seen in a Magic uniform. There is not even ONE thing he does adequately, let alone well.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
I don't know...Gilbert Arenas is still here...and Ben Wallace used to be ours too...
Seriously though, I was just commenting on Clark’s position. I don’t think he belongs on the court either, for now, especially if Q’s offense has reappeared.
Otis Smith, what you've just done is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard of. At no point in your rambling, incoherent trades were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this blog is now dumber for having witnessed it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
by MoveThoseChains on Mar 2, 2011 11:41 PM EST up reply actions
Gilbert's shot better than Clark this season.
Even disregarding his passing, Gilbert has been a more accurate scorer than Clark this season.
Even Ben Wallace has shot better than Clark this season. (Admittedly, only 0.1% better.) And Wallace, while he’s not a great passer, at least doesn’t look for his own (horrible) shot. Clark is EAGER to shoot he thing.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
(I'll use sarcasm font next time)
But yeah, it is really is horrible how eager Clark is to shoot the ball. I mean, Arenas too, but at least Arenas makes it a little more.
Otis Smith, what you've just done is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard of. At no point in your rambling, incoherent trades were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this blog is now dumber for having witnessed it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
by MoveThoseChains on Mar 3, 2011 10:54 AM EST up reply actions
Defense Does Matter
Ok I will rebuttal that last comment. Does any remember a guy name Dennis Rodman who had an awful shot but played sick defense and also rebounded? So why can’t Earl be that guy to shut down guys that we need and provide that spark.
KEEP PLAYING EARL. And I feel that if we continue to emphasize our intensity on D we can go pretty deep in the playoffs, but if we don’t like we did in the first half of last nights game its a long painful road
Okay, let's compare here.
Rodman: .546 career true shooting, slightly above league average. Had the sense to pass the ball instead of shooting it. Probably the best pure rebounder of the last 25 years, and an All-Defensive Team caliber player.
Clark: .431 career true shooting. His .445 this year would be better than a grand total of 12 NBA players if he qualified. That’s 12 out of 330… 96.4% of NBA players are more accurate shooters than Clark. Yet he’s third on the team in usage (not counting Vince).
He’s arguably somewhat above league average as a defender — strong man-to-man, kind of shaky on the rotations — but nowhere close to Rodman. And he’s the fourth-best rebounder on the Magic.
So yeah, he’s kind of like Rodman, if Rodman were an incredibly inaccurate scorer, insisted on shooting all the time anyway, wasn’t an elite defender, and was somewhat below average on the boards. So, you know, little differences.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.
by 3.3seconds on Mar 3, 2011 3:22 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Clark's energy is more important than his ability
What he does is get the team fired up with his hard play. That’s all he’s really in for – when the Magic are flat, he can spark some run by hustling, crashing the boards and working hard.
by eltharion_doa on Mar 3, 2011 5:44 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe we should give Gil some 5-hour energy before gametime. That should fix every thing!
Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.
"We have a great bunch of outside shooters. Unfortunately, all our games are played indoors." - Weldon Drew
by Both_Teams_Played_ on Mar 3, 2011 7:55 AM EST up reply actions
Except that when he's in, he usually takes more shots than anyone.
And he’s arguably the worst scorer in the NBA.
And he’s a downgrade from Bass or Anderson as a rebounder.
And honestly, I don’t feel he’s any better than Bass at man-to-man D, and he’s definitely less reliable than Anderson.
Bass and sharks are BOTH fish.

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