Evaluating Dwight Howard
I don't think there's a more misunderstood player in the entire NBA than Dwight Howard. Neither the fans nor the media give him enough credit for what he does on both ends of the floor, and if this idea sounds familiar, it should: Stan Van Gundy, who's coached Howard's Orlando Magic for the last 3 seasons, talks about it all the time. Howard has won the last two Defensive Player of the Year awards, has led the league in rebounding and shot-blocking in each of the last two seasons, and has led the league in total rebounds in each of the last four seasons, and he's only 24 years old. Media often trot out the "defense wins championships" aphorism, conveniently forgetting that offense is half the game, and no one defends better than Howard. Yet they seem to take his D for granted, and instead focus on his offensive shortcomings. Just last week, Chris Mannix of Sports Illustrated called Howard's offense "pathetic," for instance, despite his averaging 21.8 points per game against the Boston Celtics' duo of Kendrick Perkins and Rasheed Wallace, who cover him about as well as anyone else in the entire league. The issue here is expectation, as I'll illustrate below the fold.
| Dwight Howard | ||
|---|---|---|
| No. 12 | ||
| Center | ||
| Points Per Game | Rebounds Per Game | Blocks Per Game |
| 18.3 | 13.2 | 2.8 |
| Points Per 36 | Rebounds Per 36 | Blocks Per 36 |
| 19.0 | 13.7 | 2.9 |
| PER | Rebound Rate | Block Rate |
| 24.0 | 22.0 | 6.0 |
| FG% | 3FG% | FT% |
| .612 | .000 | .592 |
| eFG% | TS% | |
| .612 | .630 | |
All statistics in this table from Howard's player page at basketball-reference. Career-high statistics highlighted in gold. | ||
The fact is, Howard was largely lauded for his performance last year, which included selections to the All-Star Team, the All-NBA First Team, and the All-Defensive First Team in addition to his Defensive Player of the Year award. He garnered the same honors this season and posted nearly identical numbers, yet NBA observers like Mannix try to paint him as some sort of disappointment. Sorry, but to me, if you're an elite player by 2008/09 standards, you're an elite player by 2009/10 standards as well. We're not talking about some cross-era paradigmatic shift here. This is just one season. But to hear a lot of people tell it, Howard had a down year.
In truth, he improved. Moderately. His scoring stats are down due largely to his lowest usage rate since the 2006/07 season, which we can almost entirely pin to new arrival Vince Carter's asserting himself in Orlando's offense. But he improved slightly as a rebounder and shot-blocker, and led the NBA in field goal percentage.
But being great isn't good enough, apparently, and I think I've figured out why. Take a look at this Synergy Sports Technology breakdown of his possession usage from the 2008/09 season:
And now this year:
He posted up a bit more, at the expense of cutting to the basket, but that's about the only change.
Now, let's look at his efficiency by play type over the last two seasons. In case it's unclear, the blue bars represent 2008/09, and the red ones represent 2009/10:
So he improved in the three play types most commonly used, and though he regressed in a few others, he's still well above average. Overall, Howard ranked in the 85th percentile of offensive players in 2008/09, compared to the 90th percentile this season. There is no way to argue that he got worse. None. I guess the commercials he filmed didn't actually affect his game then, right?
But plenty of people, it seems, expect more from Howard. They want him to be a back-to-the-basket nightmare with a zillion and one moves, capable of scoring 25 points a night while still locking down the defensive end. They aren't crazy. Given his age, it's reasonable that he'll one day get there. Where I think they're off is in their belief that he can only become a truly elite if he does that. As it stands, Howard is the best player at his position and, at worst, the 5th-best player in the league. He could make no improvement whatsoever for the next several seasons, maintain that standing, and still be elite.
Now, obviously, it would help Howard if he had more moves down low. To my eyes, his moves are similar, but the improved touch with either hand is what's made him more efficient in the low block. He'd do well to develop some hesitation moves, or pump fakes... anything to make his movements more difficult to time. We've seen guys like Wallace, Perkins, and Shaquille O'Neal, who've each put considerable time and effort into studying Howard, simply wait out his moves, then leap to block or contest his shot at the precise moment they have to. In short, Howard's moves are too easily predicted.
And if you're sitting at home nodding, thinking I just proved your argument right, I'd advise thinking again. Even with the predictable arsenal, Howard's post game ranked 19th in points per possession with players who posted up at least 350 times, according to Synergy, which is more efficient than a list of players that includes O'Neal, Carlos Boozer, Andrew Bogut, and Chris Kaman. And only 7 players' post-ups produced scores more often. We need to rid ourselves of this thinking that Howard is some sort of liability down low, because he isn't. There's certainly room for improvement, but he already stands as one of the league's better post players. And if that's the weakest part of his game, he and the Magic are in excellent shape for years to come. Further, if his work with Hakeem Olajuwon this summer bears fruit, the league's other 29 teams have quite a bit of worrying to do.
| Grade: A |
|---|
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Very good analysis here....
Dwight gets a bad rap but so do all the superstars who haven’t “delivered a championship”. If you guys don’t want him, 29 other teams would grab him in a heartbeat.
I'm Polish...what's your excuse?
Dwight.
His touch needs to be softer. Against most teams (Boston being the clearest exception), he’s strong enough to post and drift his body closer to the basket. When he plays a stronger defend he leans away while in the air. Which leads to a brick. If Hakeem can get him to be softer and not rush the shot, he’ll score at least 4 more points a game. Combine that with a 10-20% increase at the line, he’ll average 30. MVP.
by The Stan 'Stache on Jun 3, 2010 2:29 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
He "leans away" because he doesnt go up strong enough
He needs to learn he can be more aggressive against the stronger centers in the league
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Jun 3, 2010 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions
"Touch" is hard when you have tall men hanging on you
And slapping you and grabbing your arms. I’ve always thought that the only way Howard could practice free throws would be to lift heavy weights between each shot, because during a game, he’s fighting in the low post so much that his arms are too pumped to have any kind of “touch”.
I can shoot free throws, but if I do 20 push-ups and then try to shoot, it doesn’t work.
Nobody gets hammered like D12. Like Shaq, he may always have the problem where his arms are simply too strong to flip up soft arcing shots.
Still, I loved that 3-pointer he took in the all-star game.
He needs that Hakeem "pivot, fake pass, spin layup " move..
-and a Ewing mid-range jumper.
If he gets both, crown him MVP.
Grade:A+….He for the most part, played good to GREAT ball all season, He is the friggin DPOY, and I don’t that he needs a stupid mid range “Jumper” are you f’ing kidding me?work on that footwork and Free-throws and there you go….MVP- GO MAGIC!!!!!!!!
Did Shaq develop a mid range jumper?
I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?
by Souwantmyname on Jun 3, 2010 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Good point. And the mid-range jumper would come from an iso. And there isn’t much reason to pack all of our shooters on one side of the court. 4-out 1—in. He needs to post, dropstep dunk or cut the lane and hook. I could care less about his jumper.
by The Stan 'Stache on Jun 3, 2010 7:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Not fair to compare their games
Shaq prime was on a completely different level than Howard in almost every respect of the game. Shaq was physically on another level, understands the game far better than Howard, and has a touch around the hoop which Howard lacks.
But then again, Shaq is probably an all time top 5 talent, so it is rather harsh on Howard to make the comparison.
Yeah its hard to compare big men to Shaq
He was much more solid than Howard is, and probably more than Howard will ever be. Dwight has skinny legs and possesses insane upper body strength. Shaq matched that upper body strength with his tree trunk legs, and to put it frankly, he had a big ass. This combined with Shaq’s insane athleticism for his size were what made Shaq so dominant. Dwight has the athleticism but nowhere near the lower body strength that Shaq had/has. It’s kinda like comparing an elite wing player to Michael Jordan, they just aren’t going to stack up to his strengths.
I’m a fan, calm down! what i was trying to say, was that his footwork, countermoves, could be, and will be better, why do you think that he is going to work with Hakeem? for his midrange “J”?? I don’t thiink so I had to pick something for him to work on, and his Free throw work is a given)OK! is that better? GO MAGIC!!!!!
Agree with the overall grade and your extended, partial defense of his offense...
…but the reason Dwight deserves his solid “A” is primarily his defense, not his offense. I would note also note that the players who defend Dwight well tend to be those that the Magic face in the playoffs, and therefore Dwight’s general success in the regular season is not necessarily representative of his later performance (i.e., the samples are somewhat different).
I’ve been encouraged by the articles about Hakeem. Become one with the Dream, Dwight.
by gift of the magi on Jun 3, 2010 3:09 PM EDT reply actions
I think the reason the defense doesn't get mentioned much is because nobody disputes his defensive prowess
The reason to not give him an A would come on the offensive side of the ball, which is why Ben debunks those arguments in the article.
Honor is no substitute for victory.
Nice write up
Couldn’t agree more with basically everything you wrote here.
Also I’m frothing at the mouth thinking about Howard working with the Dream. Probably partly because I had to witness him dismantle the Magic; Hakeem is one of it not my favorite centers ever. He was so slick in the post, and I feel like his game more closely resembles Dwight’s maximized potential than Ewing.
I say we can stand to lose AJ, J Will, Bass, Barnes and Carter. Probably keep Foyle and maybe one of those guys to fill out the roster.
Try to obtain CJ or someone similar (I want so bad to say Collison, but I know it will probably never be). Regardless though I feel like NO and GS are ideal trade partners since they have a lot of young talent and are getting sick of not winning now. Maybe we could unload some vets to give them some balance with finals experience and pick up a couple prospects. Maybe try for Collison and/or Thornton with NO, and Watson and Randolph at GS?
PG Jameer, young stud
SG JJ, Pietrus
SF Rashard, Pietrus
PF Anderson, Gortat
C Howard, Gortat
We would still need another SG/SF wing and a big. I feel like we should focus on developing Anderson and JJ during the season into people we can count on in the playoffs. With that lineup we’d have incredible shooting and they’d play hard minus perhaps Lewis.
Bypassing the whole Lewis thing...
…I think we’ve seen enough of Gortat at PF to know that it just doesn’t work. Howard, and Gortat, and their defenders clog up the post — not only making it impossible for either of them to shoot, but also making it difficult to drive the lane. And if either one of them steps out, they can be doubled off.
The Magic's total second-round margin of victory: 101 points.
The Hawks' highest second-round game score: 98 points.
Which, frankly is an argument against any PF that thrives in (or is restricted to playing in) the post.
"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy
by magicfaninTN on Jun 3, 2010 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions
dwight is the man period.
he needs to work on his crying(gets him out of his game and starts picking fouls up) and get free throws to fall.the rest of his team needs to show up every night
Yeah, I agree he complains TOO much.
Just play the game. He’s too big to be whining. Granted, The “D” chokes him, grabs/yanks his arms, but if the refs won’t call, keep it moving.
Agreed. This is the only part of his game I have any real complaints about.
He needs to be stronger mentally. This will keep him in games and help him at the free throw line. Problem is, I don’t know how you develop that. Age and experience I guess.
The intensity has to go up, up! Not down...UP! -Stan Van Gundy
A+ It's hard to complain about being the best in the league at your position
Although I don’t know if a pump fake would help. That just seems like a good way to get fouled without getting a shot off. It’s not like he’s Paul Pierce, people won’t hesitate when they bite. They are gonna hack him so he can’t make another move.
One Freaken Second
A pump fake would be a good move to get.
Not only because it’s an effective move, but because it might cure Dwight of his habit of bringing the ball down too far before going to the hoop.
Remember, hacking him is a GOOD thing in most scenarios. When they hack Dwight, he gets approximately 1.2 points out of the play, and the opponent gets a foul.
The Magic's total second-round margin of victory: 101 points.
The Hawks' highest second-round game score: 98 points.
the man is a monster and is the best rebounder i have ever seen he changes the game by his presence alone he is our franchise…..
A+
A= for both Dwight and for this analysis. Clearly and concisely lays out the facts. At worst Top 5 in the NBA says it all.
Read www.magicbasketballonline.com ! Follow @magicbasketball !
by magicbasketballonline on Jun 3, 2010 6:05 PM EDT reply actions
+1
Great Write-up and analysis. Plus Dwight clearly deserves an A, if not A+.. 22 pts, 11 rebs vs the best Defensive team in the playoffs is all that you can ask for..
I can only imagine how he will progress this off season after working with the Dream.
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A post where everyone seems in the same page !
It was a delight to watch Dwight this year (besides some crapy games early, mainly that Pacers thing). I enjoyed so much his defense and the rest of the team need to back him up a bit more in same cases. He’s a beast in offense and I love the sound of his dunks.If I was to point out a negative besides the whining it would be to take better care of the ball in the post. He’s used to getting the ball low which allows the small defenders to strip the ball. But this is just for making an argument. His focus specialy in the second half of the season was great and even when he didn’t have great preformances he steped up in the following game. I hope he will return with a few new tricks and I believe that even his passing will be even better next year.
Don't mind my spelling. I'm a Typo Master.
Let's not forget Dwight's vision.
When he is in the post- he is very good at making the skip pass to the top of the arc. He rarely gets assists because the Magic rotate the ball to the corner. But that’s part of his offense and part of what makes him the best Center in the NBA.
I think everyone is in accord. If Dwight improves his free throw shooting, if Hakeem improves his footwork and post moves even by the smallest amount, He will actually contend for a MVP and the Magic will have a great chance at winning a Championship.
by The Stan 'Stache on Jun 3, 2010 7:33 PM EDT reply actions
Great point...
We need to get the hockey assist thing going!
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by magicbasketballonline on Jun 3, 2010 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly right.
If he learns just the two things you mention (a hesitation move and a pump fake) he won’t have to improve any more over the next decade, and he’ll dominate the entire time.
by The BBQ Chicken Madness on Jun 3, 2010 8:33 PM EDT reply actions
This write-up should be required reading for every "analyst".
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
by slickw143 on Jun 3, 2010 8:48 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Everyone should really click on the "pathetic" link
Because the author of this blog took the guys words out of context. Here is what he said in total:
======
Besides, the bigger changes can come from within. There is no question that Howard is the most dominant defensive player of this era. But his offensive repertoire is pathetic and his inability to face up and show Boston different looks stymied Orlando’s attack. Howard is a 6-foot-11, 265-pound well of still untapped talent. But any scout will say that Howard’s game has seen minimal growth over the last few years, if any at all. Magic assistant coach Patrick Ewing made a career of dropping 15-footers over defenders too afraid to press him on the perimeter. If Howard can develop a fraction of Ewing’s moves, he would become an almost unstoppable force.
========
As you can see this guy plainly commends Howard on many fronts. And he didn’t call Howard’s offense pathetic as the author of this blog wrongly said, he called Howard’s “repertiore” pathetic, which it plainly is. There is a different between your post moves being pathetic and your offense. Howard scores as many points as he does for only one reason, and that’s his physical prowess. His moves or skill around the basket is nothing short of pathetic. The guy is absolutely CORRECT. His point was that if Howard spent some time and created some moves in the post, in addition to his physical prowess, Howard would be unstoppable.
The author of this blog misrepresented the guy’s writings and then argued against the misrepresentation, lol. Nice tactic.
"Pathetic" implies a lack of effectiveness.
I mean, literally, it implies “causing pathos.” Do you mean to suggest that it’s accurate to claim that Dwight’s limited post game inspires an overwhelming feeling of sadness and sympathy in the viewer? Because there’s a lot of drama going on in basketball, but I don’t think this is part of it.
The Magic's total second-round margin of victory: 101 points.
The Hawks' highest second-round game score: 98 points.
He didn't take it out of context.
Quite playing semantic games. I don’t mean to be rude, but imo you, not BQR, are missing the entire point of Mannix’s remarks. Mannix is obviously criticizing Howard’s offensive skills.
“Offensive repertoire” = offense….and, that’s how it was used in the SI.com article. Notice that the sentence ends with “stymied Orlando’s attack”> I’m pretty sure that he is talking about how Howard’s [purported] lack of post moves [purportedly] kills Orlando’s offense. Notice he says “minimal growth” and “fraction of Ewing’s moves”? Mannix is repeating the typical garbage.
Yes, Howard has room to improve, but to say his improvement has only been minimal or to call him pathetic is flatly wrong.
"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy
by magicfaninTN on Jun 3, 2010 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions
*quit
"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy
Being illiterate is also a nice tactic.
Talking about Dwight’s offensive repertoire being “pathetic” when he has the same exact amount of moves as Shaq, who is only one of the 5 most devastating players in the post ever, is incorrect. Stating that Howard has had “minimal growth over the last few years, if at all”, is incorrect.
Stop trolling, because you’re doing it poorly.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
lol@you guys
doing the whole tag team triple quadruple team on someone just cuz they said something you dont agree with. lol stop being so offensive its not your word or the highway if not you’d be a lot more in life
they are simply defending someone who shouldn't need defending
i don’t know what people expect dwight to be able to do. he gets portrayed by the media as basically a liability on offense , when it is absolutely not the case. if he does develop his game like many people want him to do, he will be the second best player in the league.
plyka's a long-term troll
I’m still in awe of Ben (and Eddy) for being tolerant enough of such nincompoopery to not ban him.
Honor is no substitute for victory.
"Im done responding to you children" - rahido
Famous not-so-last words. As already stated, the guy’s been trolling here since before the season started, only pops up when the Magic have something bad happen, and posts long rants that amount to nothing but jibber-jabber. Like saying that the editor of this site is attacking a writer and taking things out of context when, uhhh, he quoted him saying his offensive repertoire is “pathetic” (which means he has no depth to his offensive game whatsoever). That’s what the writer was trying to say. Ben didn’t even quote the part in the same paragraph where the guy’s trying to say that Dwight has made “minimal growth over the last few years, if at all” when clearly that’s not the case.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
The post moves he's shown are actually half-decent
He simply has no touch whatsoever around the basket. Players with a soft touch usually get a friendly bounce on a lot of the post moves Howard attempts. For Howard, they simply carom off the rim because he’s just firing the ball at the basket. It’s difficult to say where that comes from — some players instinctively have a soft touch and others have hands of stone — but he needs to improve on that if he’s going to expand his game there.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
Does anyone else think Dwight would be better served to work on his lower body strength?
He seems to struggle the most on offense against defenders with thick bases who can root him out of position, and I think that may be because of a lack of lower body strength. There’s no doubt he has a powerful upper body and I wouldn’t want him to add heft in the lower body at the detriment to his agility and quickness, but I’ve always been curious as to what other fans and analysts think…
NBA Championship or bust in '09-10!!!! GO MAGIC!!!!
I'm not sure he has the physiology to bulk up his lower body.
He’s just got thin legs. I mean, look at his upper body, and then try to tell me you don’t think he puts time in for legs in the weight room. He’s obsessed with his physique. I’d say his conditioning program is already producing at the max. My $.02.
"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy
by magicfaninTN on Jun 4, 2010 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions
He should eat some food -- bulk up a bit more.
He can afford to lose a bit of speed, because a 290-pound Dwight would be even more fearsome.
The Magic's total second-round margin of victory: 101 points.
The Hawks' highest second-round game score: 98 points.
Joking, obviously.
(Mostly.)
The Magic's total second-round margin of victory: 101 points.
The Hawks' highest second-round game score: 98 points.
You can always improve your leg strength, always
Dwight played well vs the Celts, I don’t think strength is his problem. He just needs to improve his touch, a lot of his problems are mental, he just doesn’t trust the shot.. There will be times Dwight will release the ball before he gets his head around..
22 and 11 vs the Celts is pretty d@mn good..
Hakeem will help him get comfortable in the low block. He makes great moves just doesn’t finish..
If he bulks up the lower body, it would hamper his quickness, and that quickness is one of his strengths..
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Additional leg muscle doesn't hamper your quickness, it increases it
Unless you have the bodybuilder mentality.
Free Throws = F+
:) I vote for the Magic hiring a shooting coach who will follow D12 around all summer long. Sorry Mr. Ewing.
I hate Pau Gasol!
Listen.
There are things I think Dwight can improve (post moves), and things I think Dwight doesn’t need to improve (jump shots), and things Dwight does well enough already (rebounding and defense.)
But if he could improve as a free-throw shooter, that would have happened by now.
The Magic's total second-round margin of victory: 101 points.
The Hawks' highest second-round game score: 98 points.
Not necessarily, if he maintains the same shooting form on his free throws
He should start from scratch with his free throw shooting and learn the basics with a great shooting coach like Dave Hopla. Once the technique is good then he can work on his free throws. But this takes time and he doesn’t really care about all this stuff (see O’Neal, Shaq).
He cares. Watch his face when he misses.
And, I think we are all wrong to assume that he isn’t already working on free throws. He addresses it frequently in interviews. I think it would be safe to assume that he does some work with a shooting coach.
Maybe it is mental for him. Maybe it is technique. Maybe he just isn’t going to get a whole lot better. I agree with 3.3seconds; few players at his point in their careers make marked improvement in that area. Maybe with some thought we could come up with some examples, but my guess is that they will be the exception rather than the rule.
But that doesn’t stop me from either hoping he improves or smacking my forehead and yelling at Dwight through my computer when I watch him miss.
"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy
by magicfaninTN on Jun 5, 2010 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions
it is technique
his shooting motion isn’t very fluid, too mechanical
There's a difference between thinking that you care and actually caring about something
Howard thinks he cares… he doesn’t really care. When you really care you’re obsessed with a thing and put your entire time and dedication and resources and intelligence to get that thing.
He doesn’t do that.
imo, that confuses the difference between caring and obsessing. But this may just be a difference of opinion b/w you and me. And, that’s okay with me.
I think Dwight cares about improving as a player. I think he cares about his FT%. I think he puts in more than adequate time toward improving. Personally, idk why people continually question Dwight’s motivation as a player. imo, there is so much evidence to the contrary.
Regarding FTs, sometimes I think he’s in danger of caring too much and it gets in his head and actually hurts him at the line.
"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy
Yeah there are definitely mental aspects that are hard to correct
Because of their ineffable nature.
RidiculousEST thing ever
Of course he cares and puts in time and dedication and resources and his intelligence towards it. His weakness is mental with free throws which he also acknowledges and states he will put in time, dedication, resources bla bla this summer to improve at it. Sounds more like he cares, as opposed to thinking he care…you falsely believe he thinks he doesnt care and you should be giving him the benefit of doubt he’s our best player and has marginally improved every year.
I agree
He makes good moves, but doesn’t finish. If you get a good look at the basket from 3-5 feet you need to make those shots. He’s moves are getting him there..
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When Boston started doing the hack-a-Howard with 7 minutes left in the game...
I just shook my head…That’s how much they don’t respect his free throw shooting. I think he can still improve that aspect. He’s young. But I agree, I think he needs to start from scratch and change his form. I don’t care about his jump shots. Just improve the free throw and that can make a huge difference.
I hate Pau Gasol!
Dwight gets an A+ in my book...
Without Dwight, we really have no D. And most of the offense runs through him, matter of fact thanks to the genius of SVG, ALL of the O runs through him. Plus he played like a Man in the conference finals…
by Dome of the Rock on Jun 4, 2010 7:07 PM EDT reply actions

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