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Around SBN: Which Players Will Join The 3,000-Hit Club?

Don't Sell Matt Barnes Short

The Orlando Magic's 96-94 win over the L.A. Lakers yesterday stands out for several reasons, but perhaps none as prominent as Matt Barnes' physical play and willingness to engage L.A.'s Kobe Bryant and Derek Fisher in almost literal combat. As I wrote in my recap, Barnes' altercations with those two led him to become a trending topic on Twitter the world over. For a veteran of seven teams in seven seasons with career averages of 7.2 points and 4.3 boards, that's quite an accomplishment.

Now, Twitter wasn't the only place in which Barnes--whose own wildly entertaining account you can follow here, incidentally--drew attention. Orlando Sentinel columnist George Diaz published this piece shortly after the game ended explaining why Barnes is his new favorite Magic player, saying Barnes "punched" Bryant "on the red carpet," to use a Hollywood analogy. Veteran beat writer Brian Schmitz blogged that Orlando must do anything it can to keep Barnes this summer, when he can become a free agent, "even if it means going deeper into the tax or trading away somebody else." OPP commenter ggrant wrote, "Matt Barnes is damn near my favorite player right now." On the other side, Lakers fan koberules wrote, "Hey, friendly competition is cool, but he just took it over the limit." So there's no question that Barnes made an impression.

Likewise, there's no question that Barnes played a key role in Orlando's win yesterday, with 10 points, 6 boards, a steal, a crucial three-pointer with just more than a minute to play (after which he mean-mugged his way to the bench), and the aforesaid defense of Bryant. But I fear we're in danger of missing the point with our lionization of him. You won't read about Barnes' own stats in those posts I just linked, for instance, but only about his physical play. And that's a bit problematic.

Star-divide

As Schmitz wrote, it's "hard to price" the edge that Barnes brings to the team. Yesterday wasn't the first time he's garnered attention for his attitude: after a loss to Portland in January, Barnes erupted in the Magic's locker room, saying, "Talk is cheap. We gotta knock people down like they're knocking Dwight [Howard] down." He also got went forehead-to-forehead with Boston forward Paul Pierce earlier this year after Pierce fouled Howard pretty hard. In any case, he's unique among Magic players in his willingness to mix it up. And when I say "among Magic players," I mean on a franchise-wide scale. In 21 years, Orlando's never quite had a perimeter enforcer like Barnes.

So when we talk about what makes Barnes special, there's going to be a tendency to point to those incidents, or his shoving Bryant, or his screening Fisher in the backcourt so hard that Fisher fell on his rear. As fun as those confrontations were to watch--let's face it, Magic fans, you liked the hell out of them--it's unclear as to if they affected the outcome of the game. Not to put Bryant on a pedestal or anything, but he's a tough dude to irritate. Tim Povtak writes that the Lakers cracked jokes at Barnes' expense after the loss, though they were complimentary of him to an extent, and Bryant described his afternoon-long battle with Barnes as "fun."

You know what did affect the outcome of the game, though? Bryant missing 18 of his 30 shots, or needing 32 shooting possessions to score 34 points. And I don't think Barnes was in Bryant's head, necessarily, on those misses. Solid footwork, good awareness, good contests... those are the hallmarks of good defense. And that's where Barnes, who says there's no such thing as a "Kobe Stopper," is valuable. The extracurricular stuff helps, but only to a certain extent. Plenty of NBA players have "grit," "toughness," "tenacity," and all those other traits that are essentially code for "the guts to beat the hell out of people." Barnes happens to back that swagger up with contributions that can be measured. The dude's an asset, but not just for playing hard. Focus on his productivity, like the fact that LeBron James and Gerald Wallace are the only small forwards who rebound at a higher rate, or that he's averaging 10.1 points per game on 61.4% True Shooting since January 1st. At the risk of saying the entirely obvious, snagging rebounds and scoring efficiently are important, too.

I don't mean to diminish Barnes' toughness, or to say we should ignore it entirely. To me, what's more important than his toughness is his overall skill set. Jamaal Magloire and the Collins twins are but three guys who are still drawing an NBA paycheck because they play hard and beat people up. Let's not mistake Barnes for a no-talent, all-hustle, unproductive guy like those three are. He's more than that, and to think of him as such a player is to do him a disservice.

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Matt Barnes has definitely earned his starting spot

Moving Barnes to the starting lineup was one of SVG’s best ideas this season. He goes after rebounds like few other players on our team and can score at times when the offense is falling flat. These are the things I think about when you mention Matt Barnes before I even get to his willingness to mix it up, which, yes, I have to admit I love.

by Tim333 on Mar 8, 2010 2:13 PM EST reply actions  

For a veteran of seven teams in seven seasons

I agree with this statement, but 1 of those teams, the Kings, traded him in the C-Webb deal in 2005. (I still hate that Matt was included. But, sigh, it was necessary. Matt is a local kid from Sac, and he’s one of the few players from the area to actually make it to the L. So, keep that in mind too.)

Matt Barnes has done what it takes to survive in the NBA. He has a role. it’s not always glorious or sexy. But it’s a role that gets him paid (great money at that) to pay a game. I don’t blame him for wanting his money, but I can’t imagine a BETTER situation for him than Orlando.

Having said that, I could see Orlando moving Gortat (assuming they want to keep Bass to play the backup C and PF in certain matchups) for cap room to sign Barnes to a better deal (which is not something I know people here, for the most part, will agree with).

The problem with paying Barnes long term, as I see it, is that he’s going to be 31 at the end of the next season, and while Matt doesn’t have a ton of NBA mileage, at some point players slow down. It could be a very bad investment for Orlando towards the end of the contract if they were to re-sign him to big money.

On the other hand, 3 years at 4 million a year seem reasonable for Matt at what he does for the team at the moment (and conceivably in the future).

The other problem, though, is what happens with JJ Redick now? Do you keep Redick long term or do you let him go in favor of re-signing Barnes? Many decisions for Orlando, and none of them easy. Some of them, if not all, will be very unpopular. Interesting to see what happens then, but for now I hope this season culminates in rings for the Magic.

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 2:32 PM EST reply actions  

I would keep Barnes over JJ even tho JJ is more valueable. Barnes is getting better and better with Orlando.

by derekk on Mar 8, 2010 4:09 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Question:

If the Magic are thinking now, and JJ will be nearly 30 by the time they may no longer be thinking that, does it really matter with long term with him?

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 4:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes, because Vince Carter is 31 and he's the man J.J. will eventually supplant in the starting lineup

The Magic have to develop and keep the young talent they have. Redick, Anderson, Bass, Gortat, and Howard are it, really. No short-term gains for long-term losses is the right strategy, and keeping Barnes at Redick’s expense runs counter to it.

If it were up to me, I’d keep both. But I’m not in charge of Rich DeVos’ money.

by Evan Dunlap on Mar 8, 2010 5:10 PM EST up reply actions  

A 2 year deal for Barnes would be the best option for the Magic

He’s making $1.6 this season so a 2 year $5.2 deal would get him another mill per season, no state tax & he would be contending for or in possession of a title each season.

Generally you go with the younger guy but we also have to be cencerned about overpaying J.J. As much as he’s improved this season he’s still limited in certain matchups, namely the ones that will decide the post season. He can’t guard Kobe & he’s not quick enough to guard Brown. Both Kobe & Brown can guard J.J. with relative ease. J.J. will have problems with Parker but he can hold his own against Delonte for the most part but if Delonte gets back to the level he was at last season then he will cause J.J. problems on both ends. Denver has Afflalo & J.R. and Dallas with Caron & Terry. His worst matchups are in the West so at least we wouldn’t have to deal with them until the Finals but nonetheless those are in my opinion huge matchup problems.

You rarely see Barnes look inferior on the court regardless of who he’s up against and that has to have significant value to the Magic. Whether it’s Barnes individual skills or it’s his fit on the team ala being the 3rd best rebounding SF in the NBA (which is vital because ‘Shard is probably near or at the bottom of PF rebounding), his energy rubbing off on the team, his toughness (before Barnes it was Dwight vs the entire other team , now we have another guy who is willing to battle every single game) or as someone mentioned recently his high basketball IQ (which was a weakness when Pietrus was in the starting 5), it all has value and has been key in the Magic’s success. As long as we have Dwight at C & ’Shard at PF we can ill afford to lose Matt Barnes in my opinion.

Life is a series of serious choices, theories are formed from experience, never mysterious forces. - stic.man
"I'm not impressed by your performance" - GSP

by Warlando on Mar 8, 2010 5:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Vince is 33 years old

Life is a series of serious choices, theories are formed from experience, never mysterious forces. - stic.man
"I'm not impressed by your performance" - GSP

by Warlando on Mar 8, 2010 5:28 PM EST up reply actions  

No worries

31 sounded nice though

Life is a series of serious choices, theories are formed from experience, never mysterious forces. - stic.man
"I'm not impressed by your performance" - GSP

by Warlando on Mar 8, 2010 6:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Speaking of birthdays......

OSen remarks that today is Matt Barnes’. Does he get a bday post?

"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy

by magicfaninTN on Mar 8, 2010 8:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh yeah, forgot they post online the night before the print editions.

Have to be more careful interpreting their "today"s.

"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy

by magicfaninTN on Mar 8, 2010 10:40 PM EST up reply actions  

JJ is not going to be good enough for a starting spot

Drop JJ and pick up somone important to our team that will eventually replace Vince

by Vanek on Mar 8, 2010 8:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Why wouldn't he start?

Intelligent, low-usage, high-efficiency. Even if you replace Vince with another superstar, J.J.’s still good enough to be in the rotation.

I mean, if you’re not convinced that J.J. helps this team after all he’s done this season, I’m not sure what else he has to do.

by Evan Dunlap on Mar 8, 2010 8:43 PM EST up reply actions  

JJ has earned a backup spot

But your wording was he will one day supplant Carter in the starting lineup is frightening. He is a decent role player, but he would not fit my vision of a championship caliber starting SG.

by Eric9321 on Mar 8, 2010 10:16 PM EST up reply actions  

Courtney Lee would disagree.

And Redick is better than Lee.

I write for Orlando Pinstriped Post and have a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Mar 9, 2010 12:55 AM EST up reply actions  

Interesting

During the offseason, I read several articles stating that a trade between Orl & NJ for VC wouldn’t happen unless Courtney Lee was included—even though Redick was initially offered. Am I mistaken?

by shyro25 on Mar 9, 2010 2:21 AM EST up reply actions  

Nope, you are correct.

The Magic offered Redick, the Nets wanted Lee, the Magic wanted Anderson if it meant giving up Lee, and the rest is history. Boom.

I write for Orlando Pinstriped Post and have a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Mar 9, 2010 2:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Redick’s developed further this year (he started showing occasional moments late last season, particularly in the playoffs). At the time of the deal, I think there was still concern that his good play for that stretch was just a fluke. He’s also older than Lee, although only by a year, and isn’t on a rookie-scale contract any more. For a rebuilding team like the Nets, Lee was the better prospect and contract.

"When you make your final stand
I'll be right there
I'll never leave
And all I ask of you is
Believe"

by The Dark on Mar 9, 2010 8:36 AM EST up reply actions  

What?!

Are you serious or is this comedy central. And I hardly think that Courtney is thinkin g that the Magic chose Redick over him. More like the Nets chose Lee over Redick. That is absurd. But for the comparison sake, Redick has his strong points, but I would take Lee still over Redick if I had to choose. Man how quickly people forget the contributions of past players and what they brought to the table, in their ROOKIE year no less.

by Eric9321 on Mar 9, 2010 3:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Lee brought a 45% shooting, and the following per 36 minutes:
12 points, 3.3 rebounds, 1.7 assists, 1.4 steals, 1.3 turnovers, 2.9 fouls
His shooting has regressed slightly this year, especially from long range, although his scoring is up due to a higher use rate.

Last year, Redick shot 39.1%, and the following per 36 minutes:
12.4 points, 3.5 rebounds, 2.4 assists, 0.7 steals, 1.7 turnovers, 2.3 fouls
Redick didn’t shoot as well, but he scored more, rebounded more, assisted more, had a better assist-to-turnover ratio, and fouled less. Lee had more steals. This year, Redick’s shooting has improved, his assists are up and turnovers down. His rebounds have declined due to Barnes being a vacuum cleaner at SF, and his foul rate is up slightly (to 2.5 per 36), but statistically I still prefer him to Lee. Lee’s a more glamorous player due to his style, but Redick’s a very workmanlike player who’s not at all flashy, but is effective and efficient.

"When you make your final stand
I'll be right there
I'll never leave
And all I ask of you is
Believe"

by The Dark on Mar 9, 2010 3:21 PM EST up reply actions  

Man are you serious

Lee is a better defender, and has the ability to help the game in more ways than just shooting. I mean really we can’t compare guys on separate teams, but remember who got the starting minutes in the finals last year. It was not Redick for a reason. And that was in Lee’s rookie season. Man the guy is gone for one season and you guys forget the intangibles. Regardless, IMO desp[ite Redick’s improvements, I would take Lee as he has more ways to utilize him defensively and offensively.

by Eric9321 on Mar 9, 2010 4:44 PM EST up reply actions  

I would've kept CLee

It comes down to defeating elite teams in a best of 7 series so anyone capable of guarding LeBron & Kobe is key. CLee has a better chance of stopping more potential points than J.J. does of scoring so anything CLee scores would be icing on the cake. Then think about the amount of points J.J.’s guy will score on him. Clee gets twice the amount of steals per game (Orl is ranked 25th in steals), is the better rebounder, cutter, is quicker and can finish above the rim.

Postseason value, for me, is what’s most important and I think CLee easily gets the nod here.

Life is a series of serious choices, theories are formed from experience, never mysterious forces. - stic.man
"I'm not impressed by your performance" - GSP

by Warlando on Mar 9, 2010 5:39 PM EST up reply actions  

+1

Love JJ has plenty of value, but I think CLee is the better player long term. Glad to have JJ, it is nearly a wash. Getting Ryan Anderson and VC out of the deal is stealing.

FEED THE BEAST!!!
Twitter Account

by Wmillion on Mar 9, 2010 6:26 PM EST up reply actions  

There's no comparison on offense between Lee and Redick.

Redick is a far more efficient player than Lee. I’ll grant the argument that Lee, theoretically, would be a helpful player for the Magic in the playoffs because of what he brings on defense.

I think Lee is a bit overrated on the defensive side of the ball but he does have more natural tools to work with than Redick.

I write for Orlando Pinstriped Post and have a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Mar 9, 2010 7:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't say that

Redick better not be our long term answer for starting SG. That is ridiculous talk. He has gotten better, but come on. He can not be relied on for 30 minutes a night and expect us to be a championship caliber team.

by Eric9321 on Mar 8, 2010 10:12 PM EST up reply actions  

JJ is good enough to be a starter on a Championship team.

He has proven himself. He certainly has the ability (as in stamina and strength) to play in a game for 30 mins, And I truly believe he would do what he needs to do. When he was starting early this season, he had a career high game. And I believe when he was filling in for Carter, he was at times better that VC. Once he got into the rhythm of being a starter, I have no doubt he would be a success.

by GoMagicGo on Mar 8, 2010 10:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes, he can.

The key is that the Magic would need to, then, acquire a premier wing player at SF. This year, Carter serves as that “premier” wing player paired with a role player in Barnes. In theory, Redick could serve as the role player in the lineup and then Orlando could acquire the premier wing player at SF, instead of SG. Not that different.

Again, in theory.

I write for Orlando Pinstriped Post and have a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Mar 9, 2010 12:59 AM EST up reply actions  

Totally disagree

An d I have been a Redick backer for years. But this is just too far.

by Eric9321 on Mar 9, 2010 3:09 PM EST up reply actions  

If we replace VC with J.J.

I hope we replace Barnes with LeBron, Durant or ‘Melo. Otherwise I’m worried for us.

Life is a series of serious choices, theories are formed from experience, never mysterious forces. - stic.man
"I'm not impressed by your performance" - GSP

by Warlando on Mar 9, 2010 5:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Not really.

Again, I’m analyzing the situation from a hypothetical sense. Redick, if he returns to the Magic next year, probably will remain in the same role he has this year. And that’s the right decision in my opinion, but if push comes to shove, he can start. Would it be ideal? Depends largely on who’s paired with him at SF.

I write for Orlando Pinstriped Post and have a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Mar 9, 2010 6:55 PM EST up reply actions  

We're going to have get into the protecting assets argument some other time. (Let's just say I heartily disagree with it.)

Now is not that time.

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 4:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Spoken like a Kings fan.....
I could see Orlando moving Gortat (assuming they want to keep Bass to play the backup C and PF in certain matchups) for cap room to sign Barnes

Cap room? What is cap room? And how does moving Gortat help Orlando get any?

"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy

by magicfaninTN on Mar 8, 2010 6:06 PM EST up reply actions  

What does being a Kings fan have to do with that?

The Kings will have cap room this summer, and i guarantee they won’t go after Gortat despite needing much of what Gortat does provide. Why? Cost.

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 6:23 PM EST up reply actions  

'Cause you guys know what having cap room is......

ORL won’t have any for a good long time.

"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy

by magicfaninTN on Mar 8, 2010 6:35 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah Boo-hooo for the Magic. How dare they would rather be a championship contender.....

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 6:35 PM EST up reply actions  

If Gortat had Called Odom a monkey

I am sure the reaction would be different.

But its the Lakers. And we are the Magic.

Disrespect abounds….

"This is not such a bad thing to be: a deep, talented underdog with Finals experience."~Ian Thomsen on the Orlando Magic.

by BS Patrol on Mar 8, 2010 2:33 PM EST reply actions  

Good point BS, the Lakers operate in a total different world…maybe they should look at themselves before they say stupid shit. I’m pretty sure Lamar Odom is married, alledgedly, to a girl who looks like a gorilla…no joke.

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 8, 2010 3:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Say what you want about the Lakers being fine in the long run and that this was just a regular season game. But the snide (sp?) comments from Odom and the brush off comments from KB8, show you that the Magic have slightly piqued these guys’ confidence. Usually everything is all happy and fine in Laker land when a non threat beats them…yesteday’s comments from the Lakers locker room took on a different spin. Thank you Matt Barnes for getting us some respect finally.

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 8, 2010 2:53 PM EST reply actions  

Here’s a link to the quotes…not sure if those are the same from the Potvak article linked aboive:

http://espn.go.com/nba/dailydime/_/page/dime-100307/daily-dime

(yes, its from ESPN and I know I’ve warned other from reading ESPN generally…but what Magic fan couldn’t read what they had to say after yesterday’s win?)

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 8, 2010 2:58 PM EST reply actions  

LOL

Totally agree on your ESPN stance

"This is not such a bad thing to be: a deep, talented underdog with Finals experience."~Ian Thomsen on the Orlando Magic.

by BS Patrol on Mar 8, 2010 3:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Who's the idiot?

He’s calling Barnes a fool but instead of just calling him a “fool” or reciting definition he recites the Rick Ross vs 50 Cent beef. That’s hilariously disturbing considering it was vastly perceived to be a racial remark (which Odom is damn well aware of) when Rick Ross said it. And this is a team-wide inside joke? Tsk-tsk.

Life is a series of serious choices, theories are formed from experience, never mysterious forces. - stic.man
"I'm not impressed by your performance" - GSP

by Warlando on Mar 8, 2010 3:56 PM EST reply actions  

It’s completely absurd. As I said above, the Lakers operate in a different world. They are cut endless breaks by the national media, the refs, and David Stern and to those same people they can do no wrong because they bring in the money considering they are the only attractive ticket in one of the largest markets in the country. The result: you have idiots like Odom running his mouth (our Kobe running his mouth, dropping f bombs to fans in a parking lot dissing his GM and team mates) because they don’t care about the reprecussions and could give a flying fuck about being professional. (As a side note, the media spins Kobe’s tirade as his drive to win pushing him over the edge…seriously? He sounded like a 5 year old) You know since they’re Hollywood…they’re cool…everybody loves them…etc etc…they have a free pass to say stupid ass oxymoronic comments. But as you point out Warlando to everyone outside of Los Angeles County…it is hilariously disturbing how stupid those guys are and sad that their fans are completely blind to that stuff.

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 8, 2010 4:39 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Thanks ’Stache…I take pride in that. Lol.

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 9, 2010 9:37 AM EST up reply actions  

What if you're in the OC or Ventura County?

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 6:52 PM EST up reply actions  

Most everyone in the OC needs a good kick in the face.

After the game, the Suns announcers asked Lopez what he was going to do to celebrate and he said, "I'm going to kill Bart Simpson."

by Diosnomeama on Mar 8, 2010 6:56 PM EST up reply actions  

I wonder if the world would actually miss Socal if we blasted them off the map.

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 6:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes, I'm sure we would all be saddened by the loss of a bunch of vapid botox junkies.

After the game, the Suns announcers asked Lopez what he was going to do to celebrate and he said, "I'm going to kill Bart Simpson."

by Diosnomeama on Mar 8, 2010 6:59 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL @ Vapid Botox Junkies

If I never go to Socal again, I’ll never miss it.

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 7:03 PM EST up reply actions  

The only reason to go there is if you feel like taking a few years off of your lifespan.

After the game, the Suns announcers asked Lopez what he was going to do to celebrate and he said, "I'm going to kill Bart Simpson."

by Diosnomeama on Mar 8, 2010 7:07 PM EST up reply actions  

i think your confusing Socal with Beverly Hills and Hollywood

both cities for which I dont care for….

"Just by the aura of D.J. Mbenga being there, the shot missed."

by shaqfor3 on Mar 9, 2010 2:29 AM EST up reply actions  

I don't like Socal.

I’m not confusing anything.

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 9, 2010 7:56 PM EST up reply actions  

the palm tree industry would take a huge hit though..

"Just by the aura of D.J. Mbenga being there, the shot missed."

by shaqfor3 on Mar 9, 2010 2:32 AM EST up reply actions  

My only point here is that Socal has 20 million people give or take. It’s not just LA County. LOL

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I'm not sure Donald Sterling is a human being. He had to have been manufactured by someone, possibly David Stern, so that one team could solely just make profit for the NBA while doing nothing good for themselves. -- Aykis 16

by pookeyguru on Mar 8, 2010 6:56 PM EST up reply actions  

I forgot about those two counties…but there are less Laker fans as you go south. By the time you get to San Diego, most of them disappear. I don’t think those people care much for basketball after they got their beloved Clipper ripped away from them. : P

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 9, 2010 9:40 AM EST up reply actions  

Getting in people's heads.

Ben- I completely agree with everything you said with one small caveat. Fisher ran across the floor and bumped into Barnes. For those few seconds, Fisher didn’t think about the game (I wouldn’t either after that screen).

Kobe on the other hand- (I despise him). I don’t think anything get’s in his head. He is so clutch and, IMO, the best player in the game. His fundamentals are incredible. When I compare him to Lebron. Lebron is a beast and an MVP. But Kobe is so smooth (my J.V. basketball coach would have loved to watch him play). I digress, 34 pts. looks bad on a stat sheet but 12/30 is incredible.

Barnes is the man.

by The Stan 'Stache on Mar 8, 2010 6:43 PM EST reply actions  

12/30 IS incredible. Incredibly inefficient, especially when Carter had 25 points on 10 shots.

Look, Kobe is an excellent player but he’s not the best player in the game. He’s not a top five player, either. No one should compare LeBron to anyone right now because he’s in his own stratosphere, as a player.

I write for Orlando Pinstriped Post and have a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Mar 9, 2010 1:03 AM EST up reply actions  

Thanks E for pointing that out…I restrained myself from dropping my 3rd tirade on a single thread after that incredible comment.

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 9, 2010 9:41 AM EST up reply actions  

in the clutch

Lebron is the better player. Kobe has more game winner’s,but Lebron is better when the game is close. Shoots a better %, reducing the need to hit a game winner. Cleveland/Lebron has a better winning % in the clutch.

FEED THE BEAST!!!
Twitter Account

by Wmillion on Mar 9, 2010 1:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Barnes definitely affected

Kobe’s play yesterday by his defensive skill yes – but also with his intimidation – Kobe, of course says “it was fun” what else did we expect him to say?

I guarantee Kobe (who gives as good as he gets) does not relish the next match up with Barnes and I guarantee Barnes is licking his chops – not only to mark Kobe again but also Pierce (what a punk he is) and Jamsie.

Barnes is just what the Magic needed and he knows that surrounded by the talent we have he can be the critical factor in winning a championship THIS YEAR!!

by Jaxfann on Mar 8, 2010 7:14 PM EST reply actions  

I completely agree.

Fun my butt. You could tell that Barnes affected Kobe’s game. He may not have shown it through his “smooth” exterior but, he is not used to people punking him like that. And if Barnes behavior didn’t affect the rest of the team, they wouldn’t have made those idiotic comments. I don’t get Odom calling Barnes a monkey, that just seems silly to me. And whoever said that bit about Kobe looking like a 5 year old, I completely agree. When he slapped that chair yesterday, he looked like a little kid that was having a tantrum because he didn’t get his way. His behavior is atrocious and it’s ridiculous some of the crap the refs let him get away with.

by GoMagicGo on Mar 8, 2010 7:20 PM EST up reply actions  

yep…there is something to say about all the comments the rest of the Lakers said…they were embarassed…and i guarantee you subconsciously know that Orlando is a threat…

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 9, 2010 9:47 AM EST up reply actions  

lol. that was me calling KB8 a 5 year old…acts like it quite often…especially when he doesn’t get his way.

"Where do you go from here, Dion?" "I go to Toronto."
Spreading that Calgary Flames, Montreal Expos, The U, and Orlando Magic love.

by KingJafi on Mar 9, 2010 9:49 AM EST up reply actions  

I hate Kobe, but I respect the guy. I think he is looking forward to playing Barnes again. In his mind Barnes had nothing to do with his effectiveness. I do agree in part, Kobe knows like we know, that Barnes+Pietrus is the toughest match-up out of the teams in the East.

I do agree Barnes is what we need. Barnes stops Kobe from getting comfortable.

FEED THE BEAST!!!
Twitter Account

by Wmillion on Mar 8, 2010 8:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Are you kidding me?

I guarantee Kobe Bryant DOES relish the next matchup with Matt Barnes. Come on, this is freakin’ Kobe. I don’t care what anyone feels about him personally but his competitive drive is absolutely insane.

I write for Orlando Pinstriped Post and have a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Mar 9, 2010 1:04 AM EST up reply actions  

actually...

I think Kobe likes facing defenders like him that try to get in his head….he probably takes it as a challenge or something

"Just by the aura of D.J. Mbenga being there, the shot missed."

by shaqfor3 on Mar 9, 2010 2:25 AM EST up reply actions  

@ hoopnumbers.com

Just noticed that Matt Barnes scores VERY well in the regularized adjusted plus/minus numbers at Joe Sill’s site.

i.e. Matt is 11th in the league in Offensive Regularized Adjusted Plus Minus (4 year analysis, time weighted).

Understanding Sill’s modeling is taking me some time, but the numbers are interesting so far.

"I've had people say, 'I don't need to check the [player statistics]. I've seen it with my eyes.' Well, I would also say your eyes lie to you sometimes, and some of the guys you may really like and think are really doing things, when you get deeper into it, aren't or vice versa." ~Stan Van Gundy

by magicfaninTN on Mar 8, 2010 11:20 PM EST reply actions  

Hoop Numbers is a great site. Tons of goodies.

I write for Orlando Pinstriped Post and have a Twitter account.

"The second unit is kind of crazy because the second unit is only white guys." - Marcin Gortat

by erivera7 on Mar 9, 2010 1:05 AM EST up reply actions  

I know this is OT, but...

Did anyone see Andre Miller take off from the dotted line and throw a tomahawk?
WHoala.. I didn’t see that coming.. I bet no one did.. He’s darn 74y/o. LOL

by zakchi on Mar 9, 2010 1:54 AM EST reply actions  

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