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Off-Day Open Thread: Should the Orlando Magic Move Gilbert Arenas into the Starting Lineup?

If whether or not the Orlando Magic ought to bench Jameer Nelson in favor of Gilbert Arenas wasn't a hot topic before last night's Magic win romp over the San Antonio Spurs, it sure is now. Arenas, in just his third game with the team, tallied 14 points, 6 rebounds, and 9 assists in 29 minutes, and in so doing earned high praise from his coach and, in Tim Duncan and Gregg Popovich, a pair of future Hall-of-Famers from the opposition. "That's a good all-around game," Van Gundy said, indicating Arenas' box-score statistics.

And indeed it was, coming at Nelson's expense on a night when the Magic's starting point guard suffered from dehydration. Nelson played 21 minutes in the victory, and though he performed well--he scored 7 points on 3-of-4 shooting, and dished 4 assists--he was not as big a factor as Arenas was.

"I don't want to start," Arenas said following the win. "This team is too talented."

If nothing else, though, Arenas demonstrated Thursday night he's still capable of producing in a major way at the NBA level. Should Van Gundy lose confidence in Nelson, Arenas may be a viable option to replace him.

Van Gundy, for now, wants to stick with Nelson as his starter. "I don't know," was his response when asked of the possibility of replacing Nelson with Arenas. Later, he said "I don't think it matters a whole lot" with regard to who starts and who comes off the bench. The decision to keep Arenas there, he said, is that "he most easily plays two positions," referring to Arenas' ability to play shooting guard if called upon. Regardless of which one starts, Van Gundy said, Arenas and Nelson will play between 28 and 32 minutes per game. The same is true of J.J. Redick, Jason Richardson, and Hedo Turkoglu.

Poll
Should Orlando Magic coach Stan Van Gundy insert Gilbert Arenas into his starting five?
Yes, at point guard.
205 votes
Yes, at shooting guard.
75 votes
No, he's fine coming off the bench.
471 votes
I'm not sure.
52 votes

803 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 56 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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We've got enough change to adjusy to as it is

Let’s just play a few games before making another change the chemistry of the team.
Nelson obviously fine with starting, Gil seems fine coming off the bench and is providing the bench scoring/playmaking we needed, and Stan thinks that way too.
Play some games, see how this lineup before doing anything. Last thing we need right now is a potentially frustrtrated Nelson making a fragile situation ecen more so.

by logred on Dec 24, 2010 4:58 AM EST reply actions  

I feel that when you have someone who can produce so much off of the bench, you leave him there

The starting lineup is playing well, and I have severe doubts Jameer can do anything without the likes of Dwight/J-Rich/Bass/etc.

by Ol' Uncle Munnerlyn on Dec 24, 2010 4:59 AM EST reply actions  

At this point in time

I quite like him off the bench, and would keep him there unless he shows a clear ability to consistently outperform Nelson.

Nelson – Richardson – Richardson
Arenas – Redick – Turkoglu

I really like the balance of the two lineups.

by eltharion_doa on Dec 24, 2010 5:18 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

I think that Hedo is better with Jameer and Dwight and Q with the second unit for defense-rebound but
whatever works best.

Don't mind my spelling. I'm a Typo Master.

by 44792212 on Dec 24, 2010 5:40 AM EST up reply actions  

I put Richardson on the starting lineup

For his defense. Neither Redick or Turk can defend a lick, to be honest. The starting lineup is going to be the one playing most of the minutes against Allen/Pierce and Wade/James – I think it’s going to need at least one competent defender.

The defense doesn’t matter so much on the second unit because Arenas and friends should be able to outscore any second unit in the league.

by eltharion_doa on Dec 24, 2010 5:43 AM EST up reply actions  

WOW! How soon do we forget...

People forget who stopped Boston two years ago, when Garnet was injured. It was Turk on Pierce and yes… Redick on Allen! Redick was all over Allen in that series, making life miserable for him, to the surprise of everyone in the League! And Turk, with his lengh, gave Pierce lots of trouble. Alas, Turk was gone for last years Division Finals and Van Gundy did not play Redick either; we relied on Carter and Lewis… with the results we all know.

by manny55 on Dec 24, 2010 8:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Actually, SVG did rely on Redick last year against Boston as well

But I get your overall point, and agree.

Proudly mocking the Disciples of Panic (some Magic fans) since October 29, 2010.

by funny80sguy on Dec 24, 2010 8:14 AM EST up reply actions  

He did

And thats when we made a slight comeback. But JJ was kind of gassed in game 6 on top of some bad calls against Dwight.

by Mateo9399 on Dec 24, 2010 8:41 AM EST up reply actions  

Pierce destroyed Turk in that series

How soon we forget indeed.

Redick can defend Allen better than most, sure, but Turk’s couldn’t stop Pierce two years ago, there’s no reason to think he will now.

by eltharion_doa on Dec 25, 2010 3:46 AM EST up reply actions  

It's a seven game series

If you lose two of them to a single defensive matchup, you’ve got problems. Of course, if that’s the only place you get destroyed, then you’re probably going to do pretty well, but the Celtics have plenty of other players who can score as well. Ir Pierce wins them 1/7 games, Allen wins them one, Garnett wins them one and Rondo wins them one, we’re out.

Turk can’t stop Pierce – that doesn’t mean we’re going to lose a playoff series against them, but it’s one more problem we’re going to have to find a way to overcome. Personally, I prefer as few a problems as possible.

by eltharion_doa on Dec 26, 2010 8:15 AM EST up reply actions  

Balance in the two line-up is a key and something we missed lately.

I agree with Stan that it doesn’t really matter, just do what works best and Arenas from the bench seems like a good idea right now. Besides, if he plays like last night, it’s not like coming from the bench makes him less valuable. The second unit need him in the same way that Jameer has his role with the starters. Can’t wait to see a night where they’re both playing great, that would be fun. And don’t forget that Hedo looks like he’s the wild playmaking card that made him popular with this team.

Don't mind my spelling. I'm a Typo Master.

by 44792212 on Dec 24, 2010 5:38 AM EST reply actions  

Must admit...

Anderson’s “approach” did seem different/better.
Arenas, Anderson, JJ and then Q, is a helluva a 2nd team. If we continue to look for the quick leak out for some easy layups, then we are capable of hanging 120 on nearly everyone. Nothing nicer than a layup to get the jump shot going!
I still feel that Anderson is the key. If he can get going over the next 6 weeks- we could very well win 12 out of the next 15….

by mike in munich on Dec 24, 2010 7:24 AM EST reply actions  

Anderson has to step up

He’s our only true big coming off the bench right now

I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?

by Souwantmyname on Dec 24, 2010 11:13 AM EST up reply actions  

I like Gilbert as the backup

Plus, I think Jameer thrives through competition, so I think with the threat of Arenas possibly taking over the starting pg position, Jameer will play all that much better (especially with Turk now back in the lineup to take over a bit of the ball handling).

Proudly mocking the Disciples of Panic (some Magic fans) since October 29, 2010.

by funny80sguy on Dec 24, 2010 7:49 AM EST reply actions  

Dumb random thought of the day

If Washington really cared, I wonder if they had a legitimate tampering complaint against Otis and the Magic since it has been revealed that Otis and Gilbert talked 2-3 times a week for the past several years. In this particular case, the Wizards were probably ecstatic somebody else was interested in Arenas, but still.

Proudly mocking the Disciples of Panic (some Magic fans) since October 29, 2010.

by funny80sguy on Dec 24, 2010 8:18 AM EST reply actions  

thats not out of the realm of possibility

How else who’d you explain the way he got rid of Reshard Lewis?

I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?

by Souwantmyname on Dec 24, 2010 11:15 AM EST up reply actions  

Believe me,

from the Wizards’ point of view, the Magic are the suckers for taking damaged goods with Arenas. I guess that’s why it’s an even trade or something: both GMs think the other GM is a sucker for making the trade.

Otis Smith, what you've just done is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard of. At no point in your rambling, incoherent trades were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this blog is now dumber for having witnessed it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

by MoveThoseChains on Dec 24, 2010 11:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Perhaps...

it was because we were the only team interested in taking on Arenas and his albatross contract as Washington was hoping to get rid of him since John Wall is the future there.

by GameManager on Dec 24, 2010 11:26 AM EST up reply actions  

There is no question that both contract's are monumentally bad

The fact that I dont from Washington’s side is that Reshard has NO chance at playing up to the level deserving of such a contract. Gilbert still has that possibility especially now that he’s playing with Howard. Arenas put up crazy #’s in Washington without a quality low post player

I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?

by Souwantmyname on Dec 24, 2010 11:39 AM EST up reply actions  

I hear you but...

Gilbert Arenas and John Wall are both ball-dominant players. One was the future, and that was not Arenas. Shard gives them a player whose contract’s lifespan is a year shorter and someone who plays well off the ball. Shard also has an effective post game too so if he’s given more freedom than to stand behind the arc, he could be a nice compliment to Wall.

by GameManager on Dec 24, 2010 11:43 AM EST up reply actions  

Arenas

Still had working knees back then.

by eltharion_doa on Dec 25, 2010 3:49 AM EST up reply actions  

It doesn't matter who starts, but who finishes. Who do you think SVG should play in the last minutes of a close game against MIA/BOS??

 I think our most talented lineup would be Arenas, Richardson, Turk, Bass, Howard, but it seems odd to bench Nelson who was having an All Star season prior to the trade.

by Leandro on Dec 24, 2010 8:21 AM EST reply actions  

I think it depends on the team we're up against-

At the end of a game offensive and defensive adjustments are made frequently- especially with a coach’s coach like Stan.

That said, Jameer knows 100% of the plays, Arenas knows 40-50% at best, I say with the game on the line you start your experienced captains.

Go Magic/Bucs/Gators/Rays!

by chiefs_55 on Dec 24, 2010 8:45 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

This move shouldn't/won't be made right away

This topic will be iffy in a couple weeks if Arenas can maintain this level of play. Jameer and Arenas basically have the same game though Arenas is the better offensive player when healthy

I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?

by Souwantmyname on Dec 24, 2010 11:19 AM EST up reply actions  

And Nelson's

The vastly better defensive player.

by eltharion_doa on Dec 25, 2010 3:50 AM EST up reply actions  

Heck no, he's the ultimate backup PG/SG.

Jumping back and forth between being the backup PG for ~18 mins. and SG for about ~10 mins a night gives him the total minutes he deserves with his good play, while at the same time making it tougher to account for him on defense.

The biggest reason though, as cliche as it sounds, is the fact that he can provide a “spark off the bench”.

Duhon, Redick, MP, Bass, Gortat

That’s what the Magic had before, and there’s no “spark” there. Really other than Redick’s consistent scoring, I don’t remember a lot of times where this 2nd unit really played in a way that fired up the crowd and other starters. MP would do it sometimes, but it was random.

Now they have Arenas coming in, from different positions even, that can get the offense moving when they are stagnant. He can create plays to get other players going – and the backup unit has enough juice now that SVG could basically sit the entire starting lineup.

Arenas, JJ, Q, Anderson, Allen

Apart from Allen…that could be a decent starting lineup for most teams in the NBA, and it’s Arenas that provides the spark that can really allow them to play that way.

Nelson is playing ALL-STAR quality basketball this season. It’s stunning how quickly people forget that. He had a decent game last night, and he was dehydrated. It’s more than the fact that he “knows the offense”. He’s playing amazing this year in every way, and he’s been a leader on the court for the Magic. He’s their general – and it’s a role he’s played really well. Arenas is the guy you send to lead the rag-tag group around the flank, who ends up turning the tide when things look grim. It’s a one-two punch that will make the Magic really hard to stop offensively, especially when they get the half-court offense figured out.

If this team can pull themselves back into a top5 defense, they will be seriously difficult to beat.

by The BBQ Chicken Madness on Dec 24, 2010 8:40 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

This,

the only thing I’d add is that Arenas is potent against lesser opponents. This means that him playing against second-units is actually a better move than pitting him against better defenders. I like him off the bench.

http://borntohustleroses.blogspot.com/

by fwedo on Dec 24, 2010 9:30 AM EST up reply actions  

I concur 100% with both of these posts

I hope the Magic got some name tags in one of these trades

by EnnBee on Dec 24, 2010 10:21 AM EST up reply actions  

No, he's been dynamite coming off the bench.

Our 2nd unit could use his playmaking if Turk continues to start at SF. Nelson and Turk play well together since Nelson plays better off the ball than Turk and Arenas and will surrender some of the ball-handling to Turk.

by GameManager on Dec 24, 2010 11:11 AM EST reply actions  

Nelson needs Turk more than Arenas

Jameer doesnt seem to thrive when he constantly has the ball in his hands. Turk needs it which is why they work well together.

I probably know Judo! How many of you can make the same boast?

by Souwantmyname on Dec 24, 2010 11:23 AM EST up reply actions  

Maybe.

I do see a little bit of chemistry between them but since they both need the ball in their hands to be successful, I don’t think it would work out as much as a Nelson/Turk combo.

by GameManager on Dec 24, 2010 11:45 AM EST up reply actions  

I like Nelson starting

Unless Arenas starts drawing fouls at his old rate that is. If so, ’he’s back’ and needs to start at PG. Nelson would thrive in either role to be honest.

'Coach, Dwight is a nice guy. Dwight don't hit anybody. But Superman will knock the crap out of you.' - D12

by Eyriq the Red on Dec 24, 2010 1:51 PM EST reply actions  

OMG..

The last 2 games where Gilbert didn’t play as well as he did against the Spurs..absolutely NOBODY was talking about him starting over Jameer..now that he has a great game, the drama starts and people think he needs to be the starting PG…smh. Like it or not, Jameer is a key part of this team and contrary to what alot of people think..He and Dwight set the tone for us..he’s been here for 6 or 7 years and has done a great job for us. All of a sudden he has a subpar game and people want to throw him under the bus…I don’t get it. Gilbert is the spark we NEED off the bench..Jameer is the starter, and if SVG is as smart as I think he is, he will remain the starter.

by shaymac on Dec 24, 2010 9:01 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

Well said

Arenas has one good game and suddenly people seem to think he’s going to average 30 and 10 if he starts.

by eltharion_doa on Dec 25, 2010 3:51 AM EST up reply actions  

He doesn't want to start...and I'm glad...

I think it makes our bench that much more lethal…and he’s used to coming off the bench..everyone should relax about him starting talk..let OS speculate about that…

Orlando Native(By way of Parramore)

by Mr_Major on Dec 25, 2010 11:54 AM EST reply actions  

He has so many fans

Who love him rather than Orlando. I think we’re doomed to endless speculation about him starting as long as he’s not (and he’s healthy, and the Magic aren’t steamrolling the East).

by eltharion_doa on Dec 26, 2010 8:17 AM EST up reply actions  

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