Orlando Magic 90, Indiana Pacers 86
by Evan Dunlap on Nov 20, 2010 10:49 PM EST
in 2010/2011 Recaps
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PrintDwight Howard scored 14 of his game-high 25 points and blocked 2 shots in the fourth quarter, and Jameer Nelson's three-point play with 33 seconds remaining lifted the Orlando Magic to a 90-86 win over a spirited Indiana Pacers team Saturday night. The Magic overcame an uncharacteristically poor showing on the glass--the Pacers held a 51-42 edge--and a four-minute scoreless stretch in the fourth period to pull out the win, yet some positives abound for 9-3 Orlando. For one, forward Rashard Lewis busted out of his early-season slump in a big way, shooting 8-of-11 from the field and 5-of-7 from three-point range for 21 points. For another, the Magic stepped up their defensive intensity in the second half, limiting the Pacers to 34 points over the final 24 minutes after a miserable first half in which center Roy Hibbert ran roughshod over them. And the Magic never let former All-Star Danny Granger get going. The prolific scorer managed just 13 points on 5-of-18 shooting, prompting coach Stan Van Gundy to praise the individual defensive efforts of Quentin Richardson and Mickael Pietrus.
Indiana rolled in the first half, holding a three-point lead at intermission, due largely to Hibbert's efforts on the interior. But, as Van Gundy explained, the Pacers didn't run many plays for Hibbert in the second half due to his foul trouble--he picked up three in the third period--and the fact that they were trailing. Lewis went on a tear in the period to give Orlando the lead, scoring 13 points in the first 6:25, and the Pacers' offense ground to a halt as they switched to a jump-shooting, pick-and-roll-oriented group.
| Team | Pace | Efficiency | eFG% | FT Rate | OReb% | TO Rate |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Magic | 89 | 101.5 | 51.4% | 27.5 | 12.5 | 18.1 |
| Pacers | 91 | 94.9 | 42.1% | 12.4 | 30.2 | 14.4 |
| Green denotes a stat better than the team's season average; red denotes a stat worse than the team's season average. | ||||||
Credit both teams for playing hard. The Magic had a tough stretch last week where they underestimated some of their opponents, but even on the road against a team that's played mediocre ball over the last several seasons tonight, they took the game seriously. Sure, rebounding and turnovers were a problem, but I don't see them as indictments of the Magic's approach or attitude. A game that looks sloppy on paper--see all the red in the Four Factors chart?--proved pretty fun to watch as a result, with neither team ever holding a double-digit lead. The crowd at Conseco Fieldhouse, though sparse in number, made itself heard, which is unusual. And this Pacers team really gave it reason to cheer. Hibbert humbled Howard in the first half, role-players like James Posey (game-changing defense and, in the final minute, a go-ahead triple) and Brandon Rush (an efficient 14 points off the bench) chipped in... Indiana looked like a playoff team.
The Pacers planned to foul Howard mercilessly in the second half, and particularly in the final period. That's not a surprise, given coach Jim O'Brien's track record of having his guys hammer Howard inside. Howard didn't exactly punish Indiana at the foul line, going 11-of-19, but he also converted some tough field goals in heavy traffic when the officials let a lot of contact go uncalled. He carried Orlando on both ends in the final frame. The 14 points in the fourth were huge, sure, especially with Posey making the Magic think twice before passing the ball around the perimeter. I don't think, though, we can overlook his shot-blocking on consecutive late Indy possessions. He erased T.J. Ford in transition, following a missed trey by Nelson, with 2:09 to play. On the next possession, he got just high enough to tip Rush's floating jumper off the glass and into Vince Carter's awaiting arms.
Carter had a rough night at the offensive end, missing 9 of his 12 shot attempts, but he did manage to pull down 9 rebounds and sink the game-clinching free throws.
The Magic aim for their fifth straight win Monday night in San Antonio. The Spurs will offer a stiffer test than the resurgent Pacers, but the Magic have at least picked their defense up enough that they should stand a decent chance of getting a win.
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Winning close games on the road is a good sign
…especially when the Magic got outrebounded by nine and committed three more turnovers.
I can’t recall the last time when the Magic’s opponent attempted 20 more shots than the Magic (Indiana had a 89-69 FGA advantage over the Magic), but the fact that the Pacers had 16 offensive rebounds had a lot to do with that.
At least the Magic were able to outshoot the Pacers from the field, FT line, and three point line, and the 19-11 advantage in free throws made helped make up for the fact the Magic were outscored 75-71 from the field.
It’s not often that Carter and Nelson will combine to shoot just 8 of 24 from the field, but they both scored clutch points at the end.
Great to see D12 come alive in the second half, and Rashard has had two good games in a row now, shooting a combined 14 of 20 in the two games.
"Bear Down, Chicago Bears"...
Chicago Blackhawks... 2010 NHL Stanley Cup Champions
Orlando Magic... 2009 NBA Eastern Conference Champions
by Mike from Illinois on Nov 21, 2010 12:11 AM EST reply actions
All great points.
Jameer and Vince started off hot for the Magic (Jameer buried something like 3 or 4 long jumpers in the first half, Vince took the ball to the hole with success), but certainly cooled off in the second. Cue Rashard burying some jumpers. I was surprised he missed any shots the way he was shooting.
The offensive rebounds to me are certainly fluky. A lot of them were just missed so badly that boxing out didn’t matter, so I wouldn’t be terribly worried about that moving forward.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
I was there, drove over from Cincinnati.
Really fun game. You could see Dwight’s focus change in the 2nd half. He was playing a lot smarter, and the loud (but sparse, yeah) crowd could only get more and more frustrated at his overall unstoppability.
In Gene We Trust.
by MoveThoseChains on Nov 21, 2010 12:33 AM EST reply actions
All the reasons why the Magic will not win where on display tonight
A terribly frustrating game to watch.
The refereeing was inconsistent and there were a lot of bizarre calls like the charging foul on VC with Foster moving and inside the circle or the call on Foster when Bass through him to the ground. I don’t believe the Magic can win without VC driving. Tonight like too many play-off games the referees put their whistles away on drives to the basket.
Who is the 2nd 3rd and 4th scoring option on the team? From the way Orlando runs their offense its whoever scores – that is after Howard its score by committee. This means a lot of people were taking the wrong shots at the wrong time because there is no hierarchy.
Do you know that Nelson passed two to three more times to Bass in the first half than he did to Vince? In fact I was getting frustrated watching Nelson do everything but not pass to VC including the last play of the half when he drew the defense to himself and lost the ball on the dribble with Vince open beside him.
Duhon is an offensive liability – I believe Williams is a better ball handler and definitely the better scorer.
Reddick’s slump is getting worrisome. Without a strong showing from JJ off the bench the 2nd line is looking a lot more ordinary. This will catch-up to Orlando against the elite teams.
I think that SVG’s approach will result in the Magic winning a lot of regular season games; the team has more depth and superior talent in comparison to most clubs. But when Orlando plays the elite teams and the bench on these teams shortens its a much different game. Lack of offensive discipline will do them in – from letting multiple players throw-in from the sidelines to running end of quarter plays too early. I think that to win Orlando must keep their primary scorers involved offensively. You can’t have Vince taking four shots in a half and Lewis getting his first shot of the game in the 2nd quarter and expect them to crank up their offense in the play-offs.Tonight we had a 6-0 lead and on the next 5 possessions we went to Howard resulting in 1 point. Meanwhile the guys scoring early aren’t getting the touches for a long stretch because Nelson is scoring himself or passing inside to Howard. Live by the sword…
It sure looked like the Pacers gave this one away despite Orlando’s best efforts to give it back. Two tough games on the horizon and still much to prove against the league’s best teams.
What I am saying is that the Magic are a regular season team
Overwhelm the less talented in the regular season. I do not believe that the Magic are more talented than Boston and Miami so to win they need to execute better. Too many players and lack of consistency on offense don’t make the Magic chances in the play-offs better when the bench shortens for other teams, in my opinion.
We’ll how they do as the start to meet contenders this week in San Antonio and Miami.
by consultant99 on Nov 21, 2010 5:49 PM EST up reply actions
You don't believe the Magic are more talented than Boston or Miami?
You don’t believe they’re more talented than a Miami team whose rotation includes Joel Anthony, Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Carlos Arroyo…?
You don’t believe they’re more talented than a Boston team with no marquee offensive talent (Pierce is, um, a stretch)?
Well, you at least have to believe they have a better defense than either, right? because they definitely have that.
You mess with the 4-out/1-in, you get the Horns.
I'd still say Boston has a better D, when push comes to shove.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
except boston hasnt been statistically better defensively ever since their championship year
they just happen to match up well with orlando’s strengths/weaknesses
Yeah, but we know they had KG's injury two years ago, and last year they coasted in the season.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
You want him playing 20 minutes a night for YOUR contending team?
What;‘s to underrate? It’s far from clear he still has the (pretty average) passing skills he came into the league with, he’s a limited scorer, and he plays worse defense than anyone short of J-Will.
Which is an especially bad look for the Heat… unlike a lot of teams, they don’t actually need a backup PG who can run an offense. LeBron runs the offense, and Wade can do it too. All they need is a guy who can play defense and sink threes. They have the second half of that equation, but he’s called Eddie House, not Arroyo.
In all fairness, I’m not sure Arroyo won’t be one of those guys who’s squeezed out of the rotation, either because of the playoffs or because of the return of Miller.
But, you know, whatever. I think we can all agree that the Heat’s frontcourt is their biggest problem, especially with Haslem out. Their grab bag of bad point guards is probably a secondary concern.
You mess with the 4-out/1-in, you get the Horns.
I just don't look at Arroyo with those eyes
I feel he’s a pretty good passer, hustles, he’s quick, he’s not that bad defensively, has good court awareness etc. It’s just the way I see him to be, which is better than you seem to.
Maybe.
I recall him being horrendous on defense with Orlando. And I actually rather liked him then.
He’s no kind of leader, of course, though that may be for the best given the state of this Miami team. Some point guard trying to be vocal is the last thing they need.
You mess with the 4-out/1-in, you get the Horns.
It's a tough give and take. Good & Bad
Nelson, a good point guard, a scoring point guard, does miss some great opportunities for other players. READ CLEARLY!!! He’s had great assist numbers the last 2 games. I’m thrilled to see that. I think everyone would agree that on a team full of shooters and a world class big man, a PG of Jameer’s talent should average 8+ assists per game. Let’s hope he keeps these numbers up. Drive and dish lil fella. Look for (often) wide open teammates. Take your own shots when options are limited or we need a boost.
Dwight really picked up the energy in the 2nd half. Hope it wasn’t the result of having Hibbert in foul trouble. He gets very frustrated when the opposing big plays well. His whining is still awful. Why can it not be stopped. Whining never effects the outcome of the call. Dwight even struggles not to whine when he DOES get the call. Have you noticed that? It’s become so natural for him to bitch that even when the whistle does go his way it takes several seconds for him to realize that and shut his trap. I love him but his poor little brain just gets so frazzled. It’s like post game or halftime interviews. “What were the keys to success tonight Dwight?” followed by the inevitable “We just gotta play hard”.
Stop those interviews and just ask someone else please! Rashard answers pretty well, J.J. is always on point with his answers even when his shot is not. Don’t strain Dwight mind with such challenging word play :)
by Matty B on Nov 21, 2010 4:33 AM EST via mobile reply actions
they interview the player who played the best and/or the star players
jj will get a halftime/postgame interview when he manages to make a freaking shot
MagicMark... reading coprehension issues?
I clearly said “JJ’s answers seem to be on point even when his shot is not”. You must have stopped reading that sentence half way through. Seems to happen a lot on here. Peoples attention spans are very weak sometimes. Also I’m not questioning the “format” of who they interview after the game or at halftime. That’s been a staple of broadcasting for as long as sports television has existed. I was simply saying that asking Dwight anything is an exercise in futility. Your going to get the same 10 words every single time, no mater the question, no matter the situation. So thank you for informing me that people like to interview the player with the best stats/ or the star player. Very revealing info and I hope you continue to read and remark on my posts in the future. But be weary. I’m quite skilled in the verbal destruction of those how fail to properly absorb my well wielded word play.
are you really that bored as to critique the post game interview?
newsflash: it doesn’t matter
Maybe Dante should've asked Rashard why the Magic are trying to give him open shots?
Because, as was made clear in the previous thread, it’s silly to try to get a struggling shooter easy opportunities to get going.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
Who said it was silly or a bad idea? Perhaps you're ability to read is struggling?
If your referring to a previous post of mine where I said and I quote “They are clearly spoon feeding Rashard easy opportunities” they you are way off base. I made that statement at the time to inform anyone who got overly excited about that performance that it was perhaps the result of those easy opportunities. The practice of finding easier shots for a struggling player is only logical. I mean, did you think I was suggesting we find harder shot for him? I in now way at any point said it was a bad idea or a bad strategy. Just dropping some knowledge for those who were wearing blinders for that game.
Perhaps you should read more carefully before trying to throw a weak, smart ass retort after one of my posts. NOW… IF YOU WERE NOT REFERRING TO MY previous post then forgive my attack. I’m here to help you lil fellas understand :)
"we just got to play hard and do our job on the defensive end"
chill, we all rout for the same team.
And you continue not to get it.
If a player can get himself into a position where his teammates can get him easy shots, that’s good offense.
That is the extent of good offense. (Well, that and the ability to get the ball to those players for those shots.)
There is nothing else involved in good offense but a) getting open for easy shots and b) finding the guy who is open. That’s all there is. Ever.
You mess with the 4-out/1-in, you get the Horns.
I did not consider IND to be a good measuring stick for the Magic before heading to the two tough games ahead.
But they were in a few certain ways, as have been noted by Evan, appropriately:
1 – Magic’s defense was outstanding in the second half with few exceptions.
2 – Rashard is back! He has been showing form – on and off – in recent games, but last night his shots were firm and confident. I wish I could say the same about other slumping players – J.J., Q, and Duhon to some extent, although Duhon shows signs of getting comfortable – but realistically one cannot expect for all slumping players to come out of it simultaneously.
3 – Dwight calmed down in the second half which is a good sign of maturing. His silly – and unnecessary – offensive foul and the technical and constant whining which followed were the low lights of the night, but I am glad that a different Dwight showed up in the second half. That is the mature Dwight which we need at all times, and he needs to realize how important it is for the team to have the luxury of having him on the floor.
4 – The team that showed up last night would have a hard time to match SA or MIA – considering the amount of turnovers and offense bugging down at times badly – and that is why I like the test of SA before we meet MIA. We have to be able not only to play the kind of defense required to beat either of the two teams, but also need to have our sharpshooters in cue to make the open shots when presented to them. I am glad that SA’s game is before MIA’s game, because we can afford a bad showing in SA, but not one at home against MIA.
MIA lost last night with Wade being out, which shows the validity of my theory of the fragile nature of the team, whereby extended injuries to James or Wade could/would render them to a vulnerable team. If that coincides with any injury to Bosh, they would become an ordinary team. I see BOS a greater threat in the East considering that they have solidified their front-line and Nate Robinson has acclimated to the team.
again, one game in november has absolutely no correlation to how we would potentially play a team in a playoff series
we could lose to miami by 50 and still beat them in the playoffs
So in your view no single game has any meaning, whatsoever.
Let me understand what you are trying to convey. Are you saying that we lost to MIA in their building, and losing by 50 in our building means nothing because we could miraculously turn around and beat them in the play-offs? How do you support that lame logic? And how do you deal with the team’s psyche in a game that is all about confidence?
The game is also about strategy, athleticism, team chemistry, coaching....
Etcetera, etcetera. Injuries are also part of the game, as are trades. Who knows what the rotation is going to be like for either team come May, if we even play in the playoffs? Certainly some regular season game from 7 months before won’t matter, unless it’s the same exact rotation for both sides.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
Very well stated. My point was against the argument that single games have no meaning in the bigger scheme of events. I tend to believe that they do in a lot of ways which are hard to quantify or even define at times.
That argument could only be framed in a quantitative context citing smaller sample. But the time had passed since only quantitative studies had enough validity to merit publication. In modern studies, qualitative method has regained validity especially in mixed methods research which combines both qualitative and quantitative methods. Sorry for being off-base, but just wanted to make sure that amateur statisticians don’t go off on me.
we swept the lakers the season that they beat us in the finals
those games mattered a lot at that point didn’t they?
Those games were close, but how about that we beat poor ATL so bad in the regular season which they had no confidence to go against us in the play-offs?
To ignore the very many dynamics of regular season’s games is beyond my comprehension.
I tend to agree with this
maybe not a single regular season game, but a couple of reg season games with the same team is very important. If a team beat us more than once in the reg season despite our adjustment, it will affect our approach come playoff time. Its either we play harder against them to prove something or kill our confidence.
But again, that is not considering what slickw143 said, injuries and trades is a totally different story.
“Mattered” as in, the games are useful in predicting the results of future match-ups? (I’d say they usually are.)
“Mattered” as in, the games somehow affect the results of future match-ups? That is, at best, a more dubious proposition.
We didn’t beat Atlanta in the playoffs because we beat them in the regular season. We beat them in the regular season and the playoffs because we match up absurdly well against them and had counters to their style of play.
I suppose a game could point out adjustments to a coach, but… eh.
You mess with the 4-out/1-in, you get the Horns.
Ahh, to dream...
Part of me hopes that wasn’t our best chance in the near future. Or last year, for that matter, because I thought we had the best team the entire season.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
wut
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
Rondoless Boston lost to Raptors with Pierce missing the last shot.
Barbarella with a game high 29 points. Nate had 22 points with 2(!) assists.
Don't mind my spelling. I'm a Typo Master.
lol glad to see Barbarella catching on
I'm a girl.
by TheGiantSquid on Nov 21, 2010 5:08 PM EST up reply actions
it puzzles me why Jameer can't try a fastbreak
there are couple of instances last night when he had a chance but slowed down after crossing the mid court line. For a team that, in some parts, struggles offensively it wouldn’t hurt to try once in a while. These are the times that i miss CLee :(
Some of the other folks can probably comment on this better than I
but my understanding is that the fast break/transition game is not what SVG emphasizes. So it may not be so much that Jameer can’t/doesn’t want to fastbreak-rather-it’s that the Magic believe in the half-court offense rather than the transition game.
Anyway, that’s just my understanding of it.
"I'm a Rashard Lewis Apologist."
The only time the Magic really press on transition is to get a transition 3.
So if Rashard or Pietrus or JJ come up on the side unmarked, Jameer or whoever will usually hit them for a quick three. The Magic don’t stress on forcing TO’s or rushing down the court. Stan pretty much likes to play sound, fundamental basketball on both ends it seems.
But yes, it would be nice to get some easy baskets every now and then.
I love LeBron. No really, I love Jameer.
Coach Van Gundy looks at the trade-off of certain tactics versus defensive soundness.
He does not support fast breaks which require multiple players – typically more than two – because if they fail to score, the opponent would have a chance to score on us. For the same token he does not support excessive efforts for offensive rebounding. Matt Barnes had the green light to occasionally rush for a quick put in.
That is were I think Jameer needs to come in.
he should read the situation, if he thinks that there is a great chance he or anyone can score on fast breaks he should go for it. Because SVG’s tactics are subjective on what the actual situation provides.
Again, it won’t hurt to try once in a while.
SVG keeps talking about pushing the ball in certain interviews and I think he played a
role to have J-Will in the team, who’s strenght isn’t exactly the half court. I always thought he would enjoy playing a running game but he knows very well what it does to a defense and that we don’t exactly have the athletism of a young OKC team in our roster.
Don't mind my spelling. I'm a Typo Master.
He's not a fastbreak PG. Much more effective in a halfcourt game.
And Stan isn’t big on fast-breaking anyway.
by Evan Dunlap on Nov 22, 2010 12:10 AM EST up reply actions
I really don’t think he has the elevation at the rim to finish on the break against other faster taller guards that also jump higher. In traffic his stocky frame helps him out weaving through bodies, in the open court he has no advantage.
Nate Robinson for example is super fast short guard with major hops, and even he doesn’t get out on the break that often- if he was 6’6 with that speed he’d be a fast break machine.
There’s also the problem that outside of him in the starting line-up, the other 4 are slow. The fastest guy on the court in our starting 5 besides meer is probably Dwight, which is an unfortunate truth, not a particular skill of Howard. Lewis, Carter, Q-rich are not exactly light footed speedsters, regardless of their other talents pushing the ball leaves Jameer pushing the ball largely by himself if he does so at speed.
by David Polega on Nov 22, 2010 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
I think he doesn't need to finish like the usual fast break PGs
he can push the ball not to finish/score but for the defense to collapse on him. Like what he is doing in his dribble-drive penetration. Only this time, the opponent’s defense aren’t set yet. So it will leave the defense scrambling and he can do his usual kick out to open players.
I think the speed of our other starting 4 is a huge factor in that though. What are the chances that quentin richardson, Vincer carter, and Rashard Lewis run back fast enough to beat 3 players back from the other side, whoever they may be. Speed abounds in the NBA, but this team is not built around nore does it have the personnel for it.
by David Polega on Nov 22, 2010 12:48 AM EST up reply actions
sad to say yes.
but not with the 2nd unit thou, JJ and Peaches can keep up with Jameer or I think they can. Peaches is not a a great finisher but he can sometimes do a good job. Again, its not in every occasion only when the opportunity present itself.
yea should have kept lee
he was our fastbreak machine but unfortunately hes gone we gotta work with what we got which is still a lot
The Heat are bracing to be without Haslem for several weeks, and possibly a few months, after tests confirmed that Miami’s leading rebounder tore a ligament in his left foot during the fourth quarter of a loss in Memphis on Saturday night.
Don't mind my spelling. I'm a Typo Master.
I was hoping they'll be in full force
Now that Haslem is unavailable and Dwade is less than 100%. It won’t be a good test of where we are as a team.
Vince has kind of sucked on the road... he looks very slow and disinterested on the road, whereas at home he's quick, athletic, and into the game mentally
Again, I think it’s a mental thing or something. He’s averaging ~9 points per game shooting ~33% on the road vs. ~57% for 17.5 at home. And it’s not only that, his approach is totally different, he looks much more athletic and quicker at home for some reason.
It’s gotta be the shoes! (he wears those white shoes at home that look lighter vs. these black shoes on the road that look like bricks :D)
No but really, it’s probably a mental thing again.
He’s in there romping up brent barry’s wife.
by David Polega on Nov 22, 2010 2:44 PM EST up reply actions
Well he said so... doesn't mean it's true
But yeah, I have real problems imagining him going crazy with parties etc, but you never know. I don’t know what’s up with him on the road… he just has no life… maybe there’s no Otis Smith there looking up his shoulder or something? Does Otis go with the team for away games?
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