The Roster, The Needs, The Possibilities
As many people are prone to point out, two things happened with the essential swap of Vince Carter for Hedo Turkoglu: the Magic got a better closer and they also got a heck of a lot thinner. Essentially, in picking up an All-Star caliber (albeit an older one) shooting guard and a young power forward, the Magic gave up a point guard, a shooting guard, a power forward, and lost a small forward to free agency. Word on the street has Marcin Gortat agreeing to terms with the Dallas Mavericks, and I don't know if Orlando would be so inclined to match. I'm not sure why they wouldn't, but then again, you could probably get a backup center for pretty cheap. Anyways, as some are inclined to point out, the Orlando roster as of today, currently looks like this:
PG - Jameer Nelson, Anthony Johnson
SG - Vince Carter, J.J. Redick
SF - Mickael Pietrus
PF - Rashard Lewis, Ryan Anderson
C - Dwight Howard
So the immediate needs that jump out are the need for a backup center that can support Dwight Howard, but also some depth at the small forward slot. If I'm not mistaken (correct me if I am) Magic still have their MLE, the BAE, and veteran's minimum to work with.
As a tertiary issue, the possibility of upgrading the depth of the backcourt is a possibility as well. However, the two primary issues are depth at the SF and C positions.
Let's address the SF issue first. I see two possible solutions for this, and I'm fairly ambivalent as to how the Magic go about doing this. Realistically, from free agency alone, either the Magic will likely have the best shot finding some sort of backup wing player to spell minutes behind Mickael Pietrus. Someone relatively cheap and can be effective in limited minutes. Off the free agent list, names that intrigue me include: Marquis Daniels, Matt Barnes, Grant Hill, and Jamario Moon. There is the possibility of landing starting talent to play in front of Pietrus, but somehow I doubt that talent would fall for the MLE, therefore, I've left names like Shawn Marion, Lamar Odom, and Marvin Williams off the list.
The second possible solution is finding a starting caliber power forward and sliding Rashard Lewis back to his natural position at SF. There seem to be a number of free agents available, and a lot of them are probably getting overlooked or are old enough to be cheap but still serviceable enough to warrant a starting spot. This provides a more traditional lineup and would add a big body and another rebounder next to Howard. Again, I believe names like Lamar Odom and David Lee to be fairly unrealistic, so people I can think of would be like Antonio McDyess, Drew Gooden, Joe Smith, or even Chris Wilcox. I'm not a huge fan of the undersized power forward, but if it's in limited minutes, meaning that SVG still will play largely a lineup of Nelson, Carter, Pietrus, Lewis, and Howard, then they become a possibility, so I would also keep in mind names like Leon Powe and Brandon Bass.
In terms of a backup center, I believe that a number could be had for the BAE or the vet's minimum. Given Howard's durability, he certainly wouldn't need a lot of minutes. Perhaps someone like Brian Skinner, Rasho Nesterovic, Zaza Pachulia, or Chris Mihm.
I had emailed Ben Q about this a little while ago, and just wanted to hear everyone here's take on it. Thanks for the input!
This FanPost was made by a member of the Orlando Pinstriped Post community, and is to be treated as the opinions and views of its author, not that of the blogger or blog community as a whole.
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I respectfully disagree
We need to sure up our backup guard situation. If you are satisfied with Redick as the backup to Vince, well, I don’t know what to say except ‘EGAD!’
Let's observe a moment of silence for CLee, Skip to my Lou, Batman, The Polish Hammer, and The Michael Jordan of Turkey... *cry*
I think besides picking up a really cheap PG
that our ‘big money’ should go to a backup (or stater, whatever) 3 and a backup 5. Stan only rotated 8-9 players when stuff got serious. Why would we go on a spree for an unnecessary backup behind JJ?
No matter what people have against him, the kid can play, and definitely play well as a back-up.
I'm not saying we need to spend big money on another guard, but it is something we need to focus on...
Your statement was “SF and C. all we need. that’s it.” That’s a ridiculous statement unless you add the context that those positions are what need to addressed FIRST, then address some other needs in providing some much needed depth at the guard positions. How many times did SVG not even play JJ last year for entire games, let alone in key moments? Thinking that JJ is a servicable backup is all well and good, but there’s NOTHING behind him and that’s a really scary thought IMO.
Let's observe a moment of silence for CLee, Skip to my Lou, Batman, The Polish Hammer, and The Michael Jordan of Turkey... *cry*
I don't think it's "ridiculous at all.
Jameer/ AJ/ PG3
Vince/ JJ
Pietrus/ SF2
Shard/ Anderson
Dwight/ C2
then we have the fillers at the end of the bench. Probably from summer league team. I don’t see how I’m being “ridiculous” at all actually.
Go right ahead continuing to have faith in JJ without any type of backup plan.
I’ll be over here being worried that this type of thing will blow up in our face.
Let's observe a moment of silence for CLee, Skip to my Lou, Batman, The Polish Hammer, and The Michael Jordan of Turkey... *cry*
Also, I'm curious where this faith in JJ came from...
Was it the Boston series? If so, I have to say that’s a small sampling of games to justify not trying to get a servicable backup SG, because I seem to remember JJ getting abused, then sent to the bench in the Cavs series. As well as he played against the Celtics, he played just as bad against the Cavs. Luckily we had DEPTH at the SG position which allowed us to explore other options when he wasn’t playing well.
Let's observe a moment of silence for CLee, Skip to my Lou, Batman, The Polish Hammer, and The Michael Jordan of Turkey... *cry*
SVG had faith in JJ
so I do too. No one has seen what he can do to evaluate him more than SVG himself and he gave him huge minutes against Boston and LA. Each season JJ has gotten better and better, look at his defense now compared to his rookie year. As noted by Ben Q his mid-range shot% was down this year and it seems like a abnormality.
With JJ, it seems like you either like him or don’t. Im on the like him side and see him as a quality backup.
"I'd hate to leave right when the getting is good." -CC
by Matt Bishoff on Jul 8, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Just as bad against the Cavs?
Redick barely even played in that series .. he played only 10 minutes!
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
And do you remember why?
He was put out there to guard Sasha, and Brown immediately PnR’d until he got LeBron on JJ and he got abused. I’m not saying he can’t play, but I don’t think he should be the ONLY option at the backup two. I guess it depends on who we get to backup Peaches and whether or not that will allow Peaches to slide to the two when Vince needs a breather or if there are any injuries in the backcourt (god forbid).
Let's observe a moment of silence for CLee, Skip to my Lou, Batman, The Polish Hammer, and The Michael Jordan of Turkey... *cry*
I do remember why and it was due to matchups.
.. Redick had to play in Game 2 due to foul trouble with Pietrus.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
He's not the problem.
Ideally, we would get a guy who could be our primary backup at both wing positions… but it doesn’t seem like the Magic are focusing too heavily on that.
Yeah, and we broke your damn shot clock too.
I could almost see swinging Anderson to SF if we absolutely positively had to
He wouldn’t be a Turkoglu-esque Point Forward, but I think he’s athletic enough to not be a defensive liability at the 3, and his size will generate problems for teams offensively. We’d need another big to do it, though (Hendrix?), since that’d remove Lewis’ backup at the 4.
Conversely, if we got a 2 that was decent (Bogans?), we could swing Carter to the 3 for smallball minutes.
Both are suboptimal, patchwork solutions, but I think we could at least try them when the games don’t count.
"When you make your final stand
I'll be right there
I'll never leave
And all I ask of you is
Believe"
Maybe...
Is he that athletic? I still haven’t had the chance to see him, but I was picturing him as a pretty unathletic guy, without the speed to play SF. If he can, that’s great. (Especially if we end up with another PF…)
Yeah, and we broke your damn shot clock too.
I don't see Anderson as a 3.
If anything, he’s a 4/5 in the Okur mold. Not athletic/quick enough to play the 3.
Agreed.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
Which is why...
we get a starting SF and keep Pietrus on the bench. He can then be used to backup SG and SF while still using JJ in matchup situations. Which is why SF and C are really our biggest needs…
Yeah, those are the biggest needs.
Big man, then a wing man. The Magic are set, basically, everywhere else.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
Yeah, I don't see us spending TOO much on a PG.
For better or worse, I think AJ is going to be our main backup next year… what we need is someone who can take time if Jameer gets hurt. AJ is all right as long as he doesn’t get above 20-25 minutes per game…
Yeah, and we broke your damn shot clock too.
The problem is
That to get someone to replace Jameer if he goes down, you’re going to be paying for starter minutes – which immediately give us problems, both financially and chemistry wise.
Our third PG is going to be a guy who can hold the fort down for a few games coming off the bench if Jameer gets a knock. If he gets another serious injury, we’re going trade fishing again.
by eltharion_doa on Jul 9, 2009 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, Otis will be forced to make another move.
I think Jameer will be fine, though.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
On the cheap, yes.
.. the third point guard won’t be anyone extravagant.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
Neither have played much.
Robinson has been the standout from the point, however. He has a shot.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
Marion
S&T for Marion, match Gortat, and then use the MLE and minimum contracts for depth. Hey, it’s not my money.
Nelson/Price/Jonnson
Carter/Pietrus/JJ
Marion/Kleiza
Lewis/McDyess/Anderson
Howard/Gortat/Hendrix/RakAttack
'Coach, Dwight is a nice guy. Dwight don't hit anybody. But Superman will knock the crap out of you.' - D12
You mention a sign-and-trade...
but forget a key element. We would need to trade players as well. Who leaves so we can get Marion? Only he comes here is on the MLE. Our roster is too thin right now to execute S&Ts.
Toronto is basically begging to trade Hedo for Marion.
Remember, we hold Hedo’s bird rights, this scenario is very doable if the Magic were interested.
'Coach, Dwight is a nice guy. Dwight don't hit anybody. But Superman will knock the crap out of you.' - D12
by Eyriq the Red on Jul 7, 2009 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions
But Otis isn't interested.
.. he already said he’s not doing a sign-and-trade.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
Maybe...
I was actually thinking what if Otis did a sign-and-trade and then swing Marion to Dallas for Josh Howard? Wasn’t Cuban kind of interested in Marion anyways?
Poor Man's GM @ poormansgm.blogspot.com
A sign & trade for Marion makes no sense, given that the Magic have 8 players on the roster right now.
Besides, he wouldn’t be a good fit on the team ..
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
I disagree
Marion fits the team perfectly. He is a glue guy that doesn’t need the ball to be effective, creates extra possessions, and rebounds better than most Free Agent bigs on the market. A SL of Nelson/Carter/Marion/Lewis/Howard is flawless…imho.
'Coach, Dwight is a nice guy. Dwight don't hit anybody. But Superman will knock the crap out of you.' - D12
by Eyriq the Red on Jul 7, 2009 7:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Flawless? That lineup has flaws ..
People like to criticize Bass for his rebounding rate (13.4% last year), but it was no better or worse than Marion (14.2%). Plus, Shawn’s shooting percentages were average, at best, and he was an inefficient player when factoring in his ORtg. I like The Matrix, but he wouldn’t be a good fit.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
I think you are missing the big picture
Like all 9 other seasons worth.
'Coach, Dwight is a nice guy. Dwight don't hit anybody. But Superman will knock the crap out of you.' - D12
by Eyriq the Red on Jul 7, 2009 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Not really. I'm concentrate on the here and now, which is most relevant.
You and I may differ in opinion, which is fine.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
Marion only works in an open court system
9 other seasons were played under such a system in Phoenix, most of which with a PG like Steve Nash running the show. Given that situation, I think anyone would look good. When you look at his stint with the heat, he’s not a great shooter, he’s an above average rebounder, but that’s about it. In a half-court system where he’s asked to be a spot-up shooter, you’re talking about a 19% 3pt shooter.
Poor Man's GM @ poormansgm.blogspot.com
I don't think
He has anything left in the tank.
"No matter where you go, you are what you are playa"-Jay Z
The Magic need a big man, then a wing man, than a point man.
It starts with trying to sign with McDyess, then going from there ..
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
What about Drew Gooden?
He seems like he’d be a decent fit next to Howard if healthy.
In terms of wing man, as I stated, Marquis Daniels and Matt Barnes are both available.
Point men is a little more difficult to find. Anthony Carter? Maybe see if GSW is willing to give up CJ Watson? Luther Head might be able to spell some minutes at the point. Ronnie Price also seemed to be doing pretty well as well.
Poor Man's GM @ poormansgm.blogspot.com
Gooden is an option, but I haven't heard any interest of him from Otis Smith.
Wing man is being targeted with Barnes, allegedly, and I feel a third point guard can be found on the Summer League roster. Russell Robinson has played well and may earn a roster spot.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
I like
Grant Hill or Matt Barnes and Nesterovic.
Nelson / AJ
VC / MP / JJ
GH or MB / MP
RL / Ryan (forgot his name)
Howard / Nesterovic
That gives us
11 players, throw in 2 more garbage players for PG and prefereably a big body and we have a shot. I want to say now though that if Nelson gets hurt for extended time this year, we are screwed. Hedo had a point guard mentality, no one else on the team has that. With that being said, Howard needs to work on his passing too, that will take away some of the need for a PG to initiate the offense. Give it down low, feed the cutter, get a layup.
Err...
Vince Carter, who was the de facto PG for the Nets as often as not last season, doesn’t have a PG mentality?
If Nelson gets a long term injury, we’ll be looking at the trade market for a replacement.
by eltharion_doa on Jul 9, 2009 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
VC can play some point.
I think Orlando fans that didn’t see much of him in New Jersey will be surprised by that.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone
Zaza is signing with the Hawkss, so that eliminates him.
I don’t like Gooden. I think he’d drive SVG mad, personally .. with his “airheadedness”.
I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.
"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone














