Poll: Deepest Orlando Magic Team Ever?

by erivera7 on Oct 15, 2009 8:01 AM EDT in Diversions

Yesterday in my interview with John Denton, I asked him whether or not he thought the 2009-2010 Orlando Magic team was the best ever. Though I didn't state it explicitly, I was alluding to the talent on the roster more than anything else. Denton accurately stated that it is the "deepest" but pointed out quickly that it will take some time before anyone knows if it indeed is the best in franchise history.

So, I thought I'd poll the community to see what everyone thinks. Is this year's iteration of the Magic, top to bottom, the deepest/most talented team the city of Orlando has seen? Granted, it's too early to state whether or not it's the best because the roster hasn't achieved very much, but it's not too early to determine whether or not the talent compares favorably or unfavorably to squads of yesteryear.

Thoughts?

I have a feeling the results will be lopsided in the favor of 'yes'. Thus, bonus question - which Magic team in the past would stack up the "best" with the '09-'10 edition?

Poll

Is the 2009-2010 Orlando Magic team the deepest ever in franchise history?

Yes

670 votes

No

16 votes

686 votes | Poll has closed

Tweet Comment 26 comments | 0 recs |

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Bonus question answer:

1994-95 Magic is the one I consider to be the best matchup.

Starting lineup:
Shaquille O’Neal
Horace Grant
Donald Royal
Nick Anderson
Anfernee Hardaway

Main bench players:
Brian Shaw
Dennis Scott
Anthony Bowie
Anthony Avent

Thoughts:
This team’s not built anything like the current Magic. Yes, Shaq’s somewhat similar to Dwight Howard, but only Anderson, Scott, Hardaway, and Bowie are proficient three-point shooters (Shaw shot .261 from range). Hardaway’s size will create issues for any of our PGs. I would foresee a lot of defensive switches, since Anderson would have difficulties with VC on the other end.
Donald Royal’s a decent shooter, but he had a solid 14.2% assist percentage in 94-95, meaning that one of every seven Magic buckets when he was on the floor were assists from him. “Point Forward” Turkoglu was around 22% last year, so Royal’s sort of Turk-lite.
Ho Grant and Shard would be a good matchup – I’d rather have Shard on our team, but I’d rather have Grant on the old team, for his defensive presence, which this team needed (13th of 27 on defense with Grant).
Shaq/Dwight would be an all-out war. This isn’t the current Shaq, this is young Shaq who’s highly mobile, strong as an ox, and has enough youthful energy that his mass isn’t a serious impediment to his endurance. I think Dwight’s a little quicker and has better vert, but Shaq’s bigger and stronger. This would be veeery interesting, and would probably come down to who could stay out of foul trouble longer.

The bench isn’t as good as the current team’s. Shaw and Bowie are good-sized (6’6") guards. Bowie’s average on both ends of the floor, while Shaw’s defensively solid but weak on offense. Dennis Scott’s a sniper who won’t kill a team on defense, but can’t be relied on as a ball-handler the way Royal can. Anthony Avent is a body to throw on the floor when Grant or O’Neal need a breather. Not bad on defense, not good on offense. Gortat would drink his milkshake. So would Bass. Avent would need three milkshakes if he wanted a drink.

"When you make your final stand
I'll be right there
I'll never leave
And all I ask of you is
Believe"

by The Dark on Oct 15, 2009 8:40 AM EDT reply actions

I guess it's true Penny would cause matchup problems on offense against Jameer.

But Jameer would shred Penny at the other end of the court as well. I remember Penny getting worked by quick point guards. Guys like Doug Overton used to give Penny all he could handle.

Nick Anderson, defensively, could handle VC. Not that VC necessarily would be shutdown or anything. But Nick wouldn’t be outmatched.

3-Deal-a-Meal was a pudgy, flat footed bum on defense. Anthony Avent, bum. Donald Royal? Pietrus should watch tapes of that guy to see what not to do. I’ll take guys like Ryan Anderson, Brandon Bass, Barnes, and Pietrus over those older guys any day.

The old Magic team put up lots of points, but I’d say the 2010 squad can be more explosive and efficient on offense. And I know 2010 is more efficient on defense. Shaq and Penny would have to carry the 95 team. Gortat would be an X-factor in controlling Shaq and tips the scales in 2010’s favor regarding the center matchup.

by CaliFlorida on Oct 15, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions

Penny was actually a decent defender, he did alright against players like Pippen, Jason Williams and Sam Cassell in particular

Those teams in the 90’s were poor transistional teams on defense, but I doubt a 6’7 in all his health and quickness would have trouble against a 5’10 guy.

"My features are that of a god, its not a facade these rappers wanna be NaS"- Nasir Jones QB's Finest

Founder and only member of the Kristin Kreuk Appreciation Society, and future Husband

Still miss em: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvvgVn0gg1E

by Wasabi Steak on Oct 15, 2009 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions

Yeah, outside of Shaq, Penny, Nick, and Horace, there's not much else on those mid-90's teams that can quite compare to what the 2009-2010 roster has in terms of depth (and the quality of it).

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone

by erivera7 on Oct 15, 2009 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions

Those 90's Magic teams used to get criticized for having some of the worst benches in the league

They really never stepped up in the Playoffs and a lot of them benefitted from Shaq and Penny creating shot opportunties on the floor. Don’t get me wrong I’ve been watching a lot of old Magic games from 92-95 lately and Royal put in work for us, but that team was defined Penny, Horace, Shaq and 3-D.

The only other deep Orlando team I can think of other than this year and last year is probably the Heart and Hustle team of 1999-2000 (Magette, Amechi, Wallace, Atkins, Tariq, Mercer, Gatling, Bo, Armstrong) but then again I dont know whether or not that was just people glamourizing a no-superstar team, but they were all pretty great that year.

"My features are that of a god, its not a facade these rappers wanna be NaS"- Nasir Jones QB's Finest

Founder and only member of the Kristin Kreuk Appreciation Society, and future Husband

Still miss em: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvvgVn0gg1E

by Wasabi Steak on Oct 15, 2009 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions

Yeah, the Shaq and Penny teams were very "starter-heavy", so to speak.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone

by erivera7 on Oct 15, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions

They had 5 players with PER's above 15

The rest were 12 and below

It's not a dunk unless your hand makes contact with the rim. Yeah, I'm talkin' to you, "Superman..."

by ben_gleicher on Oct 15, 2009 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions

Won't vote as sadly I don't know much about our old teams...

by josh99 on Oct 15, 2009 8:51 AM EDT reply actions

You can always go to Basketball-Reference.com for a reminder.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone

by erivera7 on Oct 15, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions

I had to do that for mine

Until I looked over the starters’ information, I thought 3D was still the starting SF, and I wasn’t sure who the bench was.

"When you make your final stand
I'll be right there
I'll never leave
And all I ask of you is
Believe"

by The Dark on Oct 15, 2009 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions

Well, he and Royal split time at the position.

I think some people forget about that.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone

by erivera7 on Oct 15, 2009 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions

It was split, but Scott was mostly a bench player

Royal: 68 starts, 1841 minutes
Scott: 10 starts, 1499 minutes

(the other 4 starts went to Shaw)

"When you make your final stand
I'll be right there
I'll never leave
And all I ask of you is
Believe"

by The Dark on Oct 16, 2009 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions

What I meant was I never had the chance to watch them as I was too young...

by josh99 on Oct 15, 2009 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions

There's a lot of games of the 90's team up on youtube and I've got download links to a few games in case anyone needs something

"My features are that of a god, its not a facade these rappers wanna be NaS"- Nasir Jones QB's Finest

Founder and only member of the Kristin Kreuk Appreciation Society, and future Husband

Still miss em: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvvgVn0gg1E

by Wasabi Steak on Oct 15, 2009 11:48 AM EDT reply actions

Kings fan here

And to me, I think you guys definitely had the best offseason, with the Spurs coming in 2nd place, and as far as depth, you’re not only the deepest Magic team ever, I think you might be one of the deepest teams ever period.

You’re guys team is pretty ridiculously stacked at every position. I was lobbying for the Kings to go after Gortat, someone who I think would probably start for half the teams in the NBA, and you guys retained him. And then you have Adonal Foyle as the 3rd string Center. I don’t think I’ve ever seen the depth at Center that you guys have.

At Power Forward, Rashard Lewis should probably start because he works better there. Ryan Anderson and Brandon Bass were great pickups though. Living in the Sacramento area, I went to Oak Ridge High School and got to see Anderson play for the team. He’s a real talent, and much more than the throw-in he was touted as in the Vince Carter trade.

Small Forward and Shooting guard is where you guys have the most options with Carter, Pietrus, Barnes, and Reddick. Besides Reddick, who is a Shooting Guard, the other guys can be used at either the 3 or the 2. And with a good coach like Van Gundy there are a lot of different lineups you guys can throw for different situations.

And again, at point guard you’re also really deep. Nelson, when healthy, is a great scorer and shooter (I still think he shouldn’t have played in the Finals last year but whatever). Johnson and Williams are both veterans that know their roles and will lead the offense. You might have to worry a bit about their defense, but when you have Howard near the basket you can afford to let a few point guards attempt to get past him.

All in all, I think you guys have a phenomenal team, probably even deeper than the Kings teams of the early 2000s, and I think you guys have set yourself up for a great chance at the Championship.

In my NBA season predictions over at Sactown Royalty, I have you guys finishing with the best record in the East at 62-20 and playing the Spurs in the NBA finals. I do have the Spurs winning in 7 though, but that largely depends on their health. I know for sure that unless a miracle happens the Kings won’t be in the playoffs this year, so I’ll be rooting for the Magic again this year. Good luck on your year guys.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Oct 15, 2009 4:22 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs

Thanks for the kind words and taking the time to comment on the site, we appreciate it.

I send my best regards to StR, by the way. I look forward in seeing what ’Reke will do for the Kings.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone

by erivera7 on Oct 15, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions

Wow

What a nice guy.

Happy to have read his post!

Keep pumpin, ain't worried bout nuttin
Busters thought we was frontin, so reload and keep dumpin
Keep Sleeping on Orlando...

by BS Patrol on Oct 15, 2009 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions

Kings have some nice fans

Good luck this season!

by bandrewg08 on Oct 15, 2009 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions

Yes, but I'd prefer not to be compared to 2000s Kings who never made it to the Finals. lol

I think this team has much higher aspirations!

Let's observe a moment of silence for CLee, Skip to my Lou, Batman, and The Michael Jordan of Turkey...

Welcome Back Polish Hammer and Adonal Foyle, and Welcome Vinsanity, Ryan Anderson, Brandon Bass, and Matt Barnes!!

by malars on Oct 16, 2009 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions

We took possibly the best team of the decade to 7 games

And would have been in the finals if we made one more free throw.

The next year we were even deeper, adding Brad Miller, Keon Clark and Jim Jackson, but unfortunately Chris Webber blew out his knee in the playoffs. It’s been a long road since then, especially the last few years. Cherish these times while you can.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Oct 16, 2009 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions

Yeah, they won't last forever.

Though I don’t see why the Magic can’t be the Spurs and maintain long-term success.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone

by erivera7 on Oct 16, 2009 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions

You do have the centerpiece in Howard to build around

The Spurs have been able to stay in contention for so long by keeping the same core around Duncan, and with very good drafting. I think you guys might have a down year or two, but you’re very well set up to be good for a long time. Again, it helps to have a guy like Howard to build around.

I like your chances on being good for a while.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Oct 17, 2009 7:42 AM EDT up reply actions

Question

I have no understanding of PER. So I was wondering if you could determine using PER who has had the deepest team ever, By simply producing a roster of very high PER.

I am not asking someone to do this, just wondering if that is the most tangible way of determining it.

Keep pumpin, ain't worried bout nuttin
Busters thought we was frontin, so reload and keep dumpin
Keep Sleeping on Orlando...

by BS Patrol on Oct 15, 2009 8:16 PM EDT reply actions

PER isn't an end-all, be-all advanced metric.

It’s good to take a look at how good a player is overall, to compare players at the same position, or see how an individual has progressed from year-to-year but the main flaw about PER is that it doesn’t take into account defense very much. As such, it wouldn’t do much good looking strictly at PER to determine which NBA team was the deepest in history. There are other factors (and other statistics) to take into account.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

"Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement." - Michael Corleone

by erivera7 on Oct 15, 2009 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions